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Thread: In 84-15 vote, Senate moves forward on immigration reform

  1. #41
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    Re: In 84-15 vote, Senate moves forward on immigration reform

    Quote Originally Posted by Dapper Andy View Post
    Deniability for what?

    It's not like anyone is really enforcing these laws.
    That's another issue entirely. We need to be, but politics gets in the way of that.

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    Re: In 84-15 vote, Senate moves forward on immigration reform

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    Good catch.

    Here's a different list: California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas.

    Mexico
    California has banned the use of E-verify, and Texas and New Mexico don't have any laws on the books regulating it.

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    Re: In 84-15 vote, Senate moves forward on immigration reform

    My point was (if you're a supporter of E-verify, anyway) is that the states that most need it don't have it.

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    Re: In 84-15 vote, Senate moves forward on immigration reform

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    Yeah, and if you employed illegal aliens you you have no penalty either.
    It's been a crime to employ illegal aliens for some time now and the Clinton, Bush and Obama administration just didn't refuse to enforce our immigration laws but refused to prosecute those who hired illegal aliens.

    In 1986 the American people were told that if we reward illegal aliens amnesty, that it would never be repeated. That our borders would be secured and all of our nations immigration laws would be enforced in the interior. We were lied too.

    Since then, Congress has snuck through six more amnesties with the same promises. Again we were lied too.

    I don't know about you, but I've been lied too seven times.

    This current bill is 800 pages long with no securing of the borders and no enforcement of the laws. It just 800 pages explaining that 20 million criminals will be legalized and given citizenship as an award for breaking our laws.

    JUST ANOTHER LIE !

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    Re: In 84-15 vote, Senate moves forward on immigration reform

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Yea good luck "securing" a 1,969 mile border...
    We're the greatest country that has ever existed. A less than 2,000 mile border should not be a problem to contain if we seriously put our minds to it. Since we're just as concerned about security as Israel is, we could take a few pointers and pages out of their playbook on border security - treat trespassers in our country as enemies of the state, for example. If Israel is allowed to do it to Palestinians and other people trying to cross into areas they're not authorized to step foot in, and is backed by the U.S., then why can't we do the same to safeguard our homeland? I mean, it is the only place we've got. We should do everything under the sun to protect it, right?

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    Re: In 84-15 vote, Senate moves forward on immigration reform

    Quote Originally Posted by ReformCollege View Post
    California has banned the use of E-verify, and Texas and New Mexico don't have any laws on the books regulating it.
    The federal government should require e-verify. But of course the whole states' rights argument has poisoned that well. Not to mention the fact that conservatives don't really want it, since it will result in possible criminal prosecutions of CEOs in some of the biggest industries, including agribusiness, hospitality and meat packing. Conservatives and their constituents make big money off exploiting illegal workers and have done so for a long time. With e-verify, those industries would actually have to pay market wages.

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    Re: In 84-15 vote, Senate moves forward on immigration reform

    Quote Originally Posted by head of joaquin View Post
    Yes, the moribund moderate half of the GOP supports it, and will soon by drowned out by the extremist tea party half for doing so. It's going to get ugly.
    Watching anything die is ugly, especially watching a bill in Congress die.

    America has been lied to seven times that if illegal aliens were awarded amnesty our borders would be secured and our immigration laws would be enforced.

    No more amnesties means no more lies to the American people.

    What hasn't been tried, enforcing the immigration laws that are already on the books. I'm willing to bet if we did enforce the laws we wouldn't have a problem.

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    Re: In 84-15 vote, Senate moves forward on immigration reform

    Quote Originally Posted by Jango View Post
    We're the greatest country that has ever existed. A less than 2,000 mile border should not be a problem to contain if we seriously put our minds to it. Since we're just as concerned about security as Israel is, we could take a few pointers and pages out of their playbook on border security - treat trespassers in our country as enemies of the state, for example. If Israel is allowed to do it to Palestinians and other people trying to cross into areas they're not authorized to step foot in, and is backed by the U.S., then why can't we do the same to safeguard our homeland? I mean, it is the only place we've got. We should do everything under the sun to protect it, right?
    It's complicated, especially in border towns, where folks have relatives on either side.

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    Re: In 84-15 vote, Senate moves forward on immigration reform

    Quote Originally Posted by APACHERAT View Post
    Watching anything die is ugly, especially watching a bill in Congress die.

    America has been lied to seven times that if illegal aliens were awarded amnesty our borders would be secured and our immigration laws would be enforced.

    No more amnesties means no more lies to the American people.

    What hasn't been tried, enforcing the immigration laws that are already on the books. I'm willing to bet if we did enforce the laws we wouldn't have a problem.
    Actually I agree, it's deceptively simple: immigrants come here to work. Big industries (like hospitality, agribusiness, meat packing, and manufacturing) hire them. Enforce criminal laws against that, by throwing some CEOs into jail for hiring illegals, and that will be the end of that. No jobs, and there is no reason for immigrants to come -- they simply can't get social services here.

    But since this raises real issues about discrimination against Hispanic Americans, we have to have a powerful e-verify system which is as foolproof as possible In addition, since errors are inevitable, we have to have an expeditious appeal system -- if an e-verify check falsely claims a job applicant is not a US citizen, an immediate appeal should be available to correct the matter in 24 or less.

    That costs money. Funny that.

    By the way, this issue will fade in the future since Mexico now has a self-sustaining middle class. We'll never see again the time when millions of workers were fleeing Mexico to come to America. Mexico's economy is strong enough so that they don't have to, not in those numbers.
    Last edited by head of joaquin; 06-11-13 at 11:16 PM.

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    Re: In 84-15 vote, Senate moves forward on immigration reform

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    It's complicated, especially in border towns, where folks have relatives on either side.
    Yeah, I'm sure it is a endless source of frustration for some, but there are legitimate ways of becoming an American. I support those ways, and those ways only.

    If a special holding area near the border needs to created, which would be under dual U.S.-Mexico supervision, I'd support that, but we cannot have this steady stream of illegals just coming and going, bringing who know's what with them at their leisure.

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