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Thread: Joe Manchin says on verge of gun deal

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    Re: Joe Manchin says on verge of gun deal

    I know you know the answer, Catawba. We all know the answer. Why don't you want to say it?

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    Re: Joe Manchin says on verge of gun deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    What changes is that if the law is passed those with criminal history or mental defect, across the the country, will not be able to walk into their neighborhood gun show and buy guns for cash with no questions asked. We will have to wait to see how it will affect online sales after they get the details worked out.

    I am still trying to figure out what has changed in our society that we need all these different gun laws. I grew up in the 50’s, as a kid I could go to town to our local Western Auto and buy shells for my .410 with no questions asked. I remember at the age of 15 or 16 buying my first 12 gauge. Yet there were no Newtown’s or other mass murders or rampages. There were very few gun laws period.

    Society has changed tremendously, some for the better, some not so good. But somewhere in all those changes has to be the reason why society breeds characters like this Holmes fellow. Finding that reason or reasons would prevent more of these things from happening than all the additional gun laws one could imagine.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Joe Manchin says on verge of gun deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    What stops them?
    The threat of prison time and fines for sellers that sell guns at gun shows without a background check.

    Let's say I have some kind of disqualifying criteria you can't see with the naked eye. I go into a gun show, I see a gun I like from a private seller, I want to buy the gun. What occurs?
    What occures at gun shows today:
    Me: "I would like to buy that gun, please."
    Seller: "Ok, that'll be $XXX."
    Me: *pays seller*
    Seller: *hands me the gun*
    Me: Thanks, have a good one."
    Seller: "Thanks for your business."

    What changes?
    Under the law you would have to complete a background check so your disqualifying criteria would be discovered and you would not be sold a gun.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Joe Manchin says on verge of gun deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    I am still trying to figure out what has changed in our society that we need all these different gun laws. I grew up in the 50’s, as a kid I could go to town to our local Western Auto and buy shells for my .410 with no questions asked. I remember at the age of 15 or 16 buying my first 12 gauge. Yet there were no Newtown’s or other mass murders or rampages. There were very few gun laws period.

    Society has changed tremendously, some for the better, some not so good. But somewhere in all those changes has to be the reason why society breeds characters like this Holmes fellow. Finding that reason or reasons would prevent more of these things from happening than all the additional gun laws one could imagine.


    Increased accessibility to weapons meant for killing people not animals. We have 300 million guns in the country now. And shotguns are no longer the gun of choice for criminals and mass murderers. And a society that has taught its young through our foreign policy to solve our differences with others with guns. Might makes right!
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Joe Manchin says on verge of gun deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    The threat of prison time and fines for sellers that sell guns at gun shows without a background check.
    Regular people don't have access NICS. Here's the number, call and try to do a background check on yourself: 1-877-FBI-NICS (324-6427)

    Your first obstacle is that private sellers literally cannot perform a background check even if the law requires them to and they want to comply in every way.

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Under the law you would have to complete a background check so your disqualifying criteria would be discovered and you would not be sold a gun.
    How will law enforcement ever know any transaction even occurred? And let's say they arrest someone with a gun on them, how does law enforcement know a background check was don when they bought the gun?

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    Re: Joe Manchin says on verge of gun deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Regular people don't have access NICS. Here's the number, call and try to do a background check on yourself: 1-877-FBI-NICS (324-6427)
    Your first obstacle is that private sellers literally cannot perform a background check even if the law requires them to and they want to comply in every way.
    Good thing they though of this and have suggested having the FFL dealers, also present at gun shows, run the background checks!

    How will law enforcement ever know any transaction even occurred? And let's say they arrest someone with a gun on them, how does law enforcement know a background check was don when they bought the gun?
    Cruise gun shows undercover and bust any selling guns without a background check. After a few people go to prison, there will be fewer that take that risk.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Joe Manchin says on verge of gun deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Increased accessibility to weapons meant for killing people not animals. We have 300 million guns in the country now. And shotguns are no longer the gun of choice for criminals and mass murderers. And a society that has taught its young through our foreign policy to solve our differences with others with guns. Might makes right!
    You may be right about the accessibility of guns available to kill people. All the guns I owned were used for hunting with the exception of the .38 I have. I have had no desire to own an AK-47 or an M-16 or a glock. Although I have given plenty of thought of acquiring an M1911 .45, but in the end I decided against it as I would only use it for target practice.

    I can remember shotguns and rifles in gun racks inside the pickups driven by the teachers to my old school. But like Biden, if someone ever wanted to break in to my place, my shot guns would provide me with my best home defense even though I keep the .38 loaded with hollow points. My aim doesn’t have to be right on, close is good enough and I would have no doubt I would be a bit nervous when confronting that break in criminal.

    I am not sure it is your might makes right that has caused a lot of these rampages. It seems to me the warning signs were present way before these kids did their thing. It make me wonder who is raising these youngsters today?
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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    Re: Joe Manchin says on verge of gun deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Good thing they though of this and have suggested having the FFL dealers, also present at gun shows, run the background checks!
    FFL have to use ATF form 4473 to conduct a transfer, and that creates a registry, so that's not acceptable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Cruise gun shows undercover and bust any selling guns without a background check. After a few people go to prison, there will be fewer that take that risk.
    Just do that in the first place to test private sellers if they're selling to people who they think may not pass a NICS and forget all about any kind of new law then.
    Last edited by Jerry; 04-10-13 at 11:26 PM.

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    Re: Joe Manchin says on verge of gun deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    You may be right about the accessibility of guns available to kill people. All the guns I owned were used for hunting with the exception of the .38 I have. I have had no desire to own an AK-47 or an M-16 or a glock. Although I have given plenty of thought of acquiring an M1911 .45, but in the end I decided against it as I would only use it for target practice.

    I can remember shotguns and rifles in gun racks inside the pickups driven by the teachers to my old school. But like Biden, if someone ever wanted to break in to my place, my shot guns would provide me with my best home defense even though I keep the .38 loaded with hollow points. My aim doesn’t have to be right on, close is good enough and I would have no doubt I would be a bit nervous when confronting that break in criminal.

    I am not sure it is your might makes right that has caused a lot of these rampages. It seems to me the warning signs were present way before these kids did their thing. It make me wonder who is raising these youngsters today?
    People that advocate settling differences with guns evidently.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Joe Manchin says on verge of gun deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Only the far right believes that guns aren't bought for cash with no questions asked at gun shows across the country and resold on the street.
    Only the far wrong think there's anything wrong with that.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

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