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Thread: Scalia Wonders If Same-Sex Parents ‘Harmful’ To Children

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    Re: Scalia Wonders If Same-Sex Parents ‘Harmful’ To Children

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    First of all it is NOT illegal for a lesbian to get artificially inseminated and rasie a child with her partner. So why is the right even mentioning children, since marriage is NOT a requirement for raising children?
    So? Don't want to talk about kids? Then we can talk about that other thread exploring other kinds of marriages that may have to be allowed if marriage is declared a civil right.

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    Re: Scalia Wonders If Same-Sex Parents ‘Harmful’ To Children

    Quote Originally Posted by Somerville View Post
    Hey bubba - you screwed up the quote when you put your words into my quote box. I corrected it for you



    Yep, just another example of Scalia's 'flexibility' or as some might say - His ability to change his "judicial philosophy" depending upon the audience

    from 2010


    2011


    2012


    A review of Scalia's book, Reading Law: The Interpretation of Legal Texts A book in which Scalia has attempted to justify his simultaneous defence of originalism and flexibility in making his decisions.

    Present day academic discussion about Scalia and his originalism
    Scalia
    http://carneades.pomona.edu/2013-Law/0304-hdo.pdf
    Scalia’s Originalism
    Not sure what your point is but you might have the wrong idea about what an "originalism" approach is.
    If your point is that we should NOT interpret the Constitution the way the authors intended it then you DO have a disagreement with Scalia.

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    Re: Scalia Wonders If Same-Sex Parents ‘Harmful’ To Children

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Is it illegal for Same-sex parents to raise a child? No. So what does SSM being legalized have anything to do with rasiing children?
    Who said anything about legality with regard to children? I didn't. If you can't see any connection between marriage and children that's another problem entirely, and legality is not the issue. I legally own an AR15, so why anyone would want to discuss my right to legally own one after the fact is exactly the same kind of problem presented, and no one on the left seems the least bit dissuaded by that fact. You can make such arguments if you like, but you cannot have it both ways when it suits you.

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    Re: Scalia Wonders If Same-Sex Parents ‘Harmful’ To Children

    Quote Originally Posted by bubbabgone View Post
    So? Don't want to talk about kids? Then we can talk about that other thread exploring other kinds of marriages that may have to be allowed if marriage is declared a civil right.
    So? It is a distraction and nothing more. The whole "think of the children" routine is a last desperate effort by the right since they know they are losing ground. The only thing they can do is distract.

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    Re: Scalia Wonders If Same-Sex Parents ‘Harmful’ To Children

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    Who said anything about legality with regard to children? I didn't. If you can't see any connection between marriage and children that's another problem entirely, and legality is not the issue. I legally own an AR15, so why anyone would want to discuss my right to legally own one after the fact is exactly the same kind of problem presented, and no one on the left seems the least bit dissuaded by that fact. You can make such arguments if you like, but you cannot have it both ways when it suits you.
    Fact: Gay people can rasie children regardless of whether they are married or not.

    So, this is nothing more than a distraction by the right since no matter what the outcome, gay people will STILL be able to raise children. Distractions are all the right have left on this issue.

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    Re: Scalia Wonders If Same-Sex Parents ‘Harmful’ To Children

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    Well, let's see. We have about 6,000 years of history on the one hand, and what you claim is 50 years on the other. I'll go with the 6,000 for starters, and defer to the well-being of the children before I make a decision on the parenting of same sex parents. There is a lot of stuff in academia - some of it's great, and some of it is useless.
    During those "6,000 years of history", not counting the past 50 years, were there actual studies conducted in regards to same-sex parenting. You do know that 50 years does cover infancy to adulthood for human beings, don't you? You do know that in California alone, as Justice Kennedy noted, there are some 40,000 children presently living with same-sex parents?

    Somehow, for me, studies conducted on a single subject, Same Sex Parenting, provide better answers to the questions posed than attempting to extract personal data from "6,000 years of history" that wasn't focused on the subject. And I would venture to guess that your "6,000 years of history" are focused on Classical, Western European and American History and that the American History doesn't have much to say about First Nations actions toward gay and lesbian parents.


    and that "useless" stuff in academia tends to shift according to societal constraints and prejudices
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

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    Re: Scalia Wonders If Same-Sex Parents ‘Harmful’ To Children

    Quote Originally Posted by bubbabgone View Post
    So? Don't want to talk about kids? Then we can talk about that other thread exploring other kinds of marriages that may have to be allowed if marriage is declared a civil right.
    Still not clear on why what other people choose to do with their lives is any of your business as long as your rights aren't being violated.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
    The Psychology of Persuasion

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    Re: Scalia Wonders If Same-Sex Parents ‘Harmful’ To Children

    Quote Originally Posted by Somerville View Post
    During those "6,000 years of history", not counting the past 50 years, were there actual studies conducted in regards to same-sex parenting. You do know that 50 years does cover infancy to adulthood for human beings, don't you? You do know that in California alone, as Justice Kennedy noted, there are some 40,000 children presently living with same-sex parents?

    Somehow, for me, studies conducted on a single subject, Same Sex Parenting, provide better answers to the questions posed than attempting to extract personal data from "6,000 years of history" that wasn't focused on the subject. And I would venture to guess that your "6,000 years of history" are focused on Classical, Western European and American History and that the American History doesn't have much to say about First Nations actions toward gay and lesbian parents.


    and that "useless" stuff in academia tends to shift according to societal constraints and prejudices
    Heh. As does all that useful stuff. Useless and useful depends on the intent of the user, not to mention the person producing the stuff. 50 years isn't squat. But I have to go. It'll all get sorted out. Have a good day.

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    Re: Scalia Wonders If Same-Sex Parents ‘Harmful’ To Children

    Quote Originally Posted by bubbabgone View Post
    Not sure what your point is but you might have the wrong idea about what an "originalism" approach is.
    If your point is that we should NOT interpret the Constitution the way the authors intended it then you DO have a disagreement with Scalia.
    You're "not sure" what my point might be? First you post a quote from Scalia in which he talks about his "flexible" views on the Constitution and now you think that my post showing how Scalia's words change according to his audience don't show that Scalia is not in the least interested in interpreting what the "authors intended" when they wrote the Constitution??


    As with many Justices thru out American history, Antonin Scalia almost always puts his personal political philosophy before actual "originalist" interpretation
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

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    Re: Scalia Wonders If Same-Sex Parents ‘Harmful’ To Children

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    So? It is a distraction and nothing more. The whole "think of the children" routine is a last desperate effort by the right since they know they are losing ground. The only thing they can do is distract.
    A SC decision that can lead to legalizing "non-traditional" pairings like incest marriages is more than a distraction.
    But, hey, it does raise the question of whether there are any stats on children raised by incest parents.
    Anything on that? Anecdotal or otherwise?

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