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Thread: Report For NATO Justifies Killing Of Hackers In A Cyberwar

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    Re: Report For NATO Justifies Killing Of Hackers In A Cyberwar

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Hacking a bank =/= terrorist.

    Obviously.
    it depends on intent.

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    Re: Report For NATO Justifies Killing Of Hackers In A Cyberwar

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Computer Network Attacks can indeed be launched real-time. In a conflict, taking out the manner in which the enemy is attempting to destroy your C4I (or other) capabilities is indeed a lawful strike.
    Again, if the attack were occurring it would most likely involve proxies and or multiple different systems. The best bet would actually be to secure at the site rather than to attempt to find out where a hacker is you do not know about. It would make no difference at all if the infiltration was viral as the process is not killed because the hacker dies. Again, you would be better off working at the site to eliminate that infection than to actually try to blow up the hacker. After those things are all done you can track down the hacker with investigations and charge them, but you are not going to do that without a miracle in real time with a hacker that has the talent to cut through military encryption. this is just an excuse to get a ignorant public to endorse a strike on a target that the military will claim is an immediate thereat which they will never have to prove or be questioned on. Either that or all of our computer controlled military equipment is so hopelessly insecure it is more of a danger to us than it is to our enemy.

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    Re: Report For NATO Justifies Killing Of Hackers In A Cyberwar

    Quote Originally Posted by tererun View Post
    Again, if the attack were occurring it would most likely involve proxies and or multiple different systems.
    there's an app for that

    The best bet would actually be to secure at the site rather than to attempt to find out where a hacker is you do not know about.
    If you didn't know where the hacker was. This is akin to attempting to defeat enemy artillery by digging in without responding with counterbattery. However you are forgetting yourself. If we don't know where the hacker is, then whether or not to bomb his position isn't really that much of an issue, now, is it?

    Again, you would be better off working at the site to eliminate that infection than to actually try to blow up the hacker
    No, a smart response involves defense and offense. Information Assurance and Computer Network Defense are important pieces of the puzzle, but they are not the puzzle. If I could suggest some reading. Make sure you also cover application.

    After those things are all done you can track down the hacker with investigations and charge them, but you are not going to do that without a miracle in real time with a hacker that has the talent to cut through military encryption
    Especially given that lots of those hackers are foreign military; and you would be amazed how non-seriously the PRC takes our extradition requests for their top performers.

    this is just an excuse to get a ignorant public to endorse a strike on a target that the military will claim is an immediate thereat which they will never have to prove or be questioned on.
    You are making pretense to a world of which you know little.

    Either that or all of our computer controlled military equipment is so hopelessly insecure it is more of a danger to us than it is to our enemy.
    No, but only fools ignore the capabilities of their enemies.

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    Re: Report For NATO Justifies Killing Of Hackers In A Cyberwar

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    2) Lethal force should be a proportional response. If someone manages to make something explode over the internet and it kills people, then its reasonable to respond in kind. A power outage hardly justifies the use of violence.
    Power outages kill people. Between hospital patients and potential rioting, a well-placed power outage could kill hundreds.

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    Re: Report For NATO Justifies Killing Of Hackers In A Cyberwar

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post
    Power outages kill people. Between hospital patients and potential rioting, a well-placed power outage could kill hundreds.
    Bingo. In combat operations, we don't target enemy's power systems because we want to ruin their video gaming. That's also why CDE requires Intelligence Buy-In.

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    Re: Report For NATO Justifies Killing Of Hackers In A Cyberwar

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    it depends on intent.
    It depends on who is funding him, it depends on a lot of things, but just hacking a bank is NOT gonna get someone droned.

    Bank hack =/= terrorist

    Bank hack + KEY CONTEXT (terrorist list or terrorist funding) might.

    I was contesting someone who claimed "but someone just hacking a bank to steal might be considered a terrorist". And that person is wrong.

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    Re: Report For NATO Justifies Killing Of Hackers In A Cyberwar

    Hackers will be the new witch hunt and the newage terrorist boogie man. Some ****er will fly a drone into a school on purpose and blame it all on a hacker. The "hacker" will prolly have some family relationship to some wealthy business man who would be better off without that "hacker" in his life for whatever personal/financial reason.


    It will be soo easy to blame so much on "hackers" that I think the government will start doing it full time eventually. "Anonymous" will be the American Al Qaeda.

    It will be akin to this metaphor I pull out of my ass:
    Evil terminators take over the world. AI declares war on humanity and massacre begins. Turns out artificial-intelligence never existed. All the terminators are simply automated. There is just a man behind the joysticks making you think Evil "AI" is in control.
    I'm Finding it Harder to be a Gentleman, White Stripes ~ "You think I care about me and only me. When every girl needs help climbing up a tree."

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    Re: Report For NATO Justifies Killing Of Hackers In A Cyberwar

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post
    Power outages kill people. Between hospital patients and potential rioting, a well-placed power outage could kill hundreds.
    I was unaware of the massive casualties when California had rolling blackouts. Hospitals should have backup generators and I've never heard of riot that was caused solely by a power outage. The idiots who knock over power lines by accident don't get prosecuted for negligent homicide.

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