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Thread: DHS built domestic surveillance tech into Predator drones

  1. #21
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    Re: DHS built domestic surveillance tech into Predator drones

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Oh…but you’re ok with helicopters, aren’t you? Why are you upset at drone planes, says the Servants of State. Well first off, they already have helicopters, so they don’t need the drones.
    Helicopters require a great deal more maintenance than a UAV. UAV's are more cost effect, both short and long term, so they make more sense.
    Last edited by Surtr; 03-06-13 at 12:22 AM.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

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    Re: DHS built domestic surveillance tech into Predator drones

    Quote Originally Posted by Surtr View Post
    Helicopters require a great deal more maintenance than a UAV. UAV's are more cost effect, both short and long term, so they make more sense.
    Actually, I'd say it's quite the opposite. UAV's are more cost effective in both short and long therm, so they do not make sense to allow local government access to them. Something that simple and easy to use, they will surely abuse. At least with Helicopters there's some amount of performance which makes them not want to use them for general surveillance.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
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    Re: DHS built domestic surveillance tech into Predator drones

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Actually, I'd say it's quite the opposite. UAV's are more cost effective in both short and long therm, so they do not make sense to allow local government access to them. Something that simple and easy to use, they will surely abuse. At least with Helicopters there's some amount of performance which makes them not want to use them for general surveillance.
    So, waste tax payer money in the hopes that they won't use the equipment and personnel they spend millions to train and maintain? That's just dumb. If they have the equipment, they're going to use it as frequently as possible to justify the purchase. Cost isn't going to stop them from using the equipment they already have, and for jobs like Border Patrol, you want eyes in the sky as long as they can stay up.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

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    Re: DHS built domestic surveillance tech into Predator drones

    Quote Originally Posted by Surtr View Post
    So, waste tax payer money in the hopes that they won't use the equipment and personnel they spend millions to train and maintain? That's just dumb. If they have the equipment, they're going to use it as frequently as possible to justify the purchase. Cost isn't going to stop them from using the equipment they already have, and for jobs like Border Patrol, you want eyes in the sky as long as they can stay up.
    Make government less efficient, less proactive; yes. That is how we originally designed the system, and I do not believe the founders to be dumb.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: DHS built domestic surveillance tech into Predator drones

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Make government less efficient, less proactive; yes. That is how we originally designed the system, and I do not believe the founders to be dumb.
    That's convenient. Make it to where anyone who disagrees with you hates America.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

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    Re: DHS built domestic surveillance tech into Predator drones

    Quote Originally Posted by Surtr View Post
    That's convenient. Make it to where anyone who disagrees with you hates America.
    That's convenient. Make it to where when you can't formulate a coherent response, you make a stupid deflection argument instead.

    I never said you "hate America", I said I don't find the Founder's to be dumb and the system was built in order to make government inefficient and reactive. Which are all true. So you can stick to the facts or you can indulge your hysteria; the choice is yours.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  7. #27
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    Re: DHS built domestic surveillance tech into Predator drones

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    That's convenient. Make it to where when you can't formulate a coherent response, you make a stupid deflection argument instead.
    I gave reasons my why UAVs aren't a bad idea, and you deflected to a Pavlovian default response.

    I never said you "hate America", I said I don't find the Founder's to be dumb and the system was built in order to make government inefficient and reactive. Which are all true. So you can stick to the facts or you can indulge your hysteria; the choice is yours.
    And now you're being defensive, and throwing out subtle insults instead of "formulating a coherent response". It's convenient is all. You can't come up with a reason against the utilization of UAVs without making long raving monologue, and when somebody does walk into your little trap, you run and hide behind the founding fathers, and how you apparently love them more.

    I would have accepted that it poses a threat to the Fourth Amendment, I would have also accepted an argument on the more utilitarian qualities of helicopters and the availability of an actual helicopter crew s a machine that can't offer immediate aid and support to search and rescue missions, and I'm sure there are many more arguments to be made by people who actually want a real discussion about where the UAV fits into the civilian world, but you didn't argue any of that. You ranted, raved, and copped out.

    The UAV will be implemented, discussion of how they're used now decides how far they can go, and what necessary limitations are placed on them. If you want to live in the stone age, and pretend it isn't happening, go ahead, but don't talk down to me as though your participation here was so amazing.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

  8. #28
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    Re: DHS built domestic surveillance tech into Predator drones

    Quote Originally Posted by Surtr View Post
    I gave reasons my why UAVs aren't a bad idea, and you deflected to a Pavlovian default response.


    And now you're being defensive, and throwing out subtle insults instead of "formulating a coherent response". It's convenient is all. You can't come up with a reason against the utilization of UAVs without making long raving monologue, and when somebody does walk into your little trap, you run and hide behind the founding fathers, and how you apparently love them more.

    I would have accepted that it poses a threat to the Fourth Amendment, I would have also accepted an argument on the more utilitarian qualities of helicopters and the availability of an actual helicopter crew s a machine that can't offer immediate aid and support to search and rescue missions, and I'm sure there are many more arguments to be made by people who actually want a real discussion about where the UAV fits into the civilian world, but you didn't argue any of that. You ranted, raved, and copped out.

    The UAV will be implemented, discussion of how they're used now decides how far they can go, and what necessary limitations are placed on them. If you want to live in the stone age, and pretend it isn't happening, go ahead, but don't talk down to me as though your participation here was so amazing.
    So nothing but insults and deflections. Figures.

    I've already made all those arguments in other threads, and not living in the stone age is why I can understand the true threat of UAVs. You want to discuss, discuss it. But your immediate response was nothing more than to call an argument "dumb" because you didn't agree with it and if all you have is idiotic deflections, then run your mouth at the wall because that's about as good those arguments are.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  9. #29
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    Re: DHS built domestic surveillance tech into Predator drones

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    So nothing but insults and deflections. Figures.

    I've already made all those arguments in other threads, and not living in the stone age is why I can understand the true threat of UAVs. You want to discuss, discuss it. But your immediate response was nothing more than to call an argument "dumb" because you didn't agree with it and if all you have is idiotic deflections, then run your mouth at the wall because that's about as good those arguments are.
    I didn't call anyone dumb. You're the one making the insults by coming in and calling anyone not on your side "state pleasers", "knee benders", and "servants of the state". But whatever helps you sleep at night.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

  10. #30
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    Re: DHS built domestic surveillance tech into Predator drones

    Quote Originally Posted by Surtr View Post
    I didn't call anyone dumb.
    I said "call an argument dumb", not a person.

    Quote Originally Posted by Surtr View Post
    You're the one making the insults by coming in and calling anyone not on your side "state pleasers", "knee benders", and "servants of the state". But whatever helps you sleep at night.
    Because those are true statements, those appeasing the State will argue for these and pretty much tell people to stop worrying about it and make any excuse they can for the expansion of government power without limit.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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