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Thread: McCain claims ‘massive cover-up’ on Benghazi

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    Re: McCain claims ‘massive cover-up’ on Benghazi

    www.fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/RL32492.pdf
    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    The point being that almost 10,000 boots didn't come back home with live soldiers in them unnecessarily, and that was completely due to bad intelligence. And McCain still defends the invasion of iraq based on bad intelligence.
    www.fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/RL32492.pdf


    Indulge yourself, pay attention to the Reagan and Clinton years. Serving in the military is a serious and dangerous job even during peace time. As you'll notice, more members serving in the U.S. military were killed during the first two years of the Reagan administration than any two years in Iraq and we weren't even fighting a shooting war back then.

    In fact check out the demographics of the Vietnam War and you'll notice that the liberal activist were lying as usual.

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    Re: McCain claims ‘massive cover-up’ on Benghazi

    Quote Originally Posted by APACHERAT View Post
    www.fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/RL32492.pdf

    www.fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/RL32492.pdf


    Indulge yourself, pay attention to the Reagan and Clinton years. Serving in the military is a serious and dangerous job even during peace time. As you'll notice, more members serving in the U.S. military were killed during the first two years of the Reagan administration than any two years in Iraq and we weren't even fighting a shooting war back then.

    In fact check out the demographics of the Vietnam War and you'll notice that the liberal activist were lying as usual.


    4 were killed unnecessarily in Benghazi vs almost 5,000 killed unnecessarily in Iraq.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: McCain claims ‘massive cover-up’ on Benghazi

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    4 were killed unnecessarily in Benghazi vs almost 5,000 killed unnecessarily in Iraq.
    The 4 accomplished nothing. The 5k brought human rights and democracy to Iraq.

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    Re: McCain claims ‘massive cover-up’ on Benghazi

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    The 4 accomplished nothing. The 5k brought human rights and democracy to Iraq.
    You're making it out to be black and white. The 4 individuals in Benghazi were doing a lot to try and help the new government get on its feet in their own way, they died firstly because they went to a dangerous place to accomplish a mission, despite any failures by their chain of command the primary reason they were killed was because people wanted to kill them. Likewise many in Iraq died because people wanted to kill them and their chain of command could have done more to keep them alive. You make it sound as if there were no mistakes in Iraq and Benghazi was nothing but mistake.

    Also you're statement that Benghazi, and I take the Libya mission as a whole in that, is for nothing but in reality it has the same overall purpose as Iraq, to bring democracy and a stable friendly government to a country. Neither Iraq nor Libya is all the way there, and it may be decades before we can safely say exactly what all the effects of our respective actions in these two countries are. But to make it sound as if Libya is accomplishing nothing, and everything with Iraq is already said and done is just being willfully ignorant.

    For example in 1972 one could say that the Vietnam War accomplished the safety and security of South Vietnam. But in 1975, three years later, all you could say the US got out of the Vietnam War was a South Vietnam that lasted 3 years. Two vastly different statements and what it took for the effect of our action to truly be seen and come to fruition was time. Of course those in 1972 may have been able to see the writing on the wall or see the potential risks of things to come which eventually did come three years later, just like today many people can see the risks of potentially bad things that may come in Iraq. So like I said, it will take time to truly see what the full meaning of our War in Iraq truly was. But one thing we know without a doubt right now is not that Iraq is a place of human rights and democracy, but that there were no WMDs, we know for a fact right now that our of primary reasons to go to war was completely empty.
    Last edited by Wiseone; 02-19-13 at 02:42 AM.

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    Re: McCain claims ‘massive cover-up’ on Benghazi

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    You're making it out to be black and white.
    Cat is making it out to be the same thing. We dunno what was going on in Beng.

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    Re: McCain claims ‘massive cover-up’ on Benghazi

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    4 were killed unnecessarily in Benghazi vs almost 5,000 killed unnecessarily in Iraq.
    You have a way with numbers, did you attend LAUSD ?

    7,500 members of the military died during the Clinton administration.

    Actually that's a low number because during the Clinton administration they were dumbing down the training in the military like putting safety nets under the "confidence" obstacle courses. Yep, you can gain a lot of confidence if you know there's a safety net below you.

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    Re: McCain claims ‘massive cover-up’ on Benghazi

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Cat is making it out to be the same thing. We dunno what was going on in Beng.
    Very true he is, my reply to you goes to him as well.

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    Re: McCain claims ‘massive cover-up’ on Benghazi

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    For example in 1972 one could say that the Vietnam War accomplished the safety and security of South Vietnam. But in 1975, three years later, all you could say the US got out of the Vietnam War was a South Vietnam that lasted 3 years. Two vastly different statements and what it took for the effect of our action to truly be seen and come to fruition was time. Of course those in 1972 may have been able to see the writing on the wall or see the potential risks of things to come which eventually did come three years later, just like today many people can see the risks of potentially bad things that may come in Iraq. So like I said, it will take time to truly see what the full meaning of our War in Iraq truly was. But one thing we know without a doubt right now is not that Iraq is a place of human rights and democracy, but that there were no WMDs, we know for a fact right now that our of primary reasons to go to war was completely empty.
    It will certainly take time. People declaring failure in Egypt, Libya, Iraq, Afghan and elsewhere are a bit early in my opinion. One note: Vietnam still established US intent and capacity to intervene militarily in SE Asia.

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    Re: McCain claims ‘massive cover-up’ on Benghazi

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    It will certainly take time. People declaring failure in Egypt, Libya, Iraq, Afghan and elsewhere are a bit early in my opinion. One note: Vietnam still established US intent and capacity to intervene militarily in SE Asia.
    No one doubted our capacity to do it, but what was doubted was our capacity to do it afterwards. Think about it, the United States had the political will to go to Vietnam for over a decade, but after the Vietnam War do you think we had the will, even though we still had the physical capacity ie ships, planes, troops, etc, to do it again?

    Likewise, yes Iraq proved that we had the military capability to invade a Middle Eastern country, but there was no doubt of that before hand. Now after Iraq, do you really think the United States is going to go back into another Middle Eastern country so soon after that experience? Hell no. In regards to other Middle Eastern countries, all Iraq did was define a window of opportunity to act out a little bit more than they normally would because they know the United States is completely unwilling to invade their country and have a repeat of Iraq. They didn't need a "show of force" everyone knows that the US has the best technology, a **** ton of troops, tanks, ships, planes, etc, there was never any doubt of that.

    If I was an enemy of the United States or a hostile country I would know that I couldn't defeat them so instead of trying to do I'd look for places where they were unwilling to accept the cost it would take to remove me from power. That is why I know if I was Iran I'd see my population and country, both bigger than Iraq and Afghanistan combined, which terrain just as ugly and unforgiving, and know that for the United States to remove me from power they'd have to spend a hell of a lot of blood and money to do and the US knows that too, and most importantly I know and the US knows that the United States is not willing to pay that cost at this time. Why? Because Iraq. And now I know its the perfect time to do something like build a nuclear bomb, not openly obviously, but with enough fog so that while they may suspect it will never be enough of a suspicion to get them to rethink that invasion cost/benefit analysis.

    That's how the clever enemy would do it.

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    Re: McCain claims ‘massive cover-up’ on Benghazi

    It's one thing for "everyone to believe" and another for the US to actually do it.

    Removing the Iranian Regime will not be very difficult and nothing to do with rugged terrain. There is far greater opposition to the government in Iran than there was in Iraq, and social capital still exists there.
    Last edited by ecofarm; 02-19-13 at 03:10 AM.

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