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Thread: US To Use Drones In Chris Dorner Manhunt

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    Re: US To Use Drones In Chris Dorner Manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Isn't that what law enforcment does now on the ground with patrols? Drones just cover the sky doing the same thing. Unless of course you are against police officers patrolling as well. If so, there really isn't anything more to discuss as we just have differeing opinions.
    I will grant police officers the use of their biological sensory equipment, such as touch, taste, hearing, sight, and smell. Any electronic or mechanical augmentations to that will require warrant.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    Re: US To Use Drones In Chris Dorner Manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I will grant police officers the use of their biological sensory equipment, such as touch, taste, hearing, sight, and smell. Any electronic or mechanical augmentations to that will require warrant.
    What do you think that computer does when they run a plate or a driver's license? They also use lights, radios, and computers not just biological.

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    Re: US To Use Drones In Chris Dorner Manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    What do you think that computer does when they run a plate or a driver's license? They also use lights, radios, and computers not just biological.
    Now you're talking my style. The massive amount of databasing the government does certainly MUST be limited. Does it mean that they cannot run a plate? No. Does it mean they can run any plate at any time? No. If they witness behavior counter to the rules of the road or that which is endangering others, that is sufficient to begin investigation such as running plates. There are a lot of various scenarios which go along with this. Lights I'll give them for the public safety concern; but they need to be careful. And I think they can be granted use of some radio tech. Though not unlimited.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: US To Use Drones In Chris Dorner Manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Now you're talking my style. The massive amount of databasing the government does certainly MUST be limited. Does it mean that they cannot run a plate? No. Does it mean they can run any plate at any time? No. If they witness behavior counter to the rules of the road or that which is endangering others, that is sufficient to begin investigation such as running plates. There are a lot of various scenarios which go along with this. Lights I'll give them for the public safety concern; but they need to be careful. And I think they can be granted use of some radio tech. Though not unlimited.

    My understanding of drones is that they are doing the same thing. They are observing and an operator would have to focus in on details if they see something suspicious. The benefit is the drones can see far more and can observe a bigger area. As long as they follow the same rules as police officers do in regards to observing and running plates, people, etc. I see no problem with it. Again, these are when the units are turned over to police departments they would have to follow the same rules for oversight.

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    Re: US To Use Drones In Chris Dorner Manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    My understanding of drones is that they are doing the same thing. They are observing and an operator would have to focus in on details if they see something suspicious. The benefit is the drones can see far more and can observe a bigger area. As long as they follow the same rules as police officers do in regards to observing and running plates, people, etc. I see no problem with it. Again, these are when the units are turned over to police departments they would have to follow the same rules for oversight.
    Yes, but there's the rub. Do the police follow the rules even now? No. They assume total control of tech and then retroactively reduce use only after they're taken to court. In the meanwhile, they're essentially free to do as they want. They have helicopters, they have all sorts of tech now, they have enough. Drones will do nothing other than open up another avenue for abuse.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: US To Use Drones In Chris Dorner Manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Yes, but there's the rub. Do the police follow the rules even now? No. They assume total control of tech and then retroactively reduce use only after they're taken to court. In the meanwhile, they're essentially free to do as they want. They have helicopters, they have all sorts of tech now, they have enough. Drones will do nothing other than open up another avenue for abuse.
    That's a slippery slope IMO. Do some people in the military break the laws? Yes. Does that mean we shouldn't improve the military because they might abuse something? No

    Bad apples will happen and when abuses happen, they should put the hammer down. However, in the way I am describing drone use it is not much different that how the ground patrol officers do.

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    Re: US To Use Drones In Chris Dorner Manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    That's a slippery slope IMO. Do some people in the military break the laws? Yes. Does that mean we shouldn't improve the military because they might abuse something? No
    Does that mean they must be constrained, watched, regulated? Yes. And I think they're going to have to show some marked and statistically resolved impact of new tech before they can assume it. With the military drone planes make a lot of sense for operations innate to military practices. With what the police currently have at their command, it makes little sense for operations innate to police practices.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Bad apples will happen and when abuses happen, they should put the hammer down. However, in the way I am describing drone use it is not much different that how the ground patrol officers do.
    Then the ground patrol officer is sufficient.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: US To Use Drones In Chris Dorner Manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    No problem, thank you for your concession!
    Oh, there was no concession made. I just know that you and I are of differing opinion. So, there's not much else to discuss.

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    Re: US To Use Drones In Chris Dorner Manhunt

    Drones don't do anything manned aircraft can't do. Mountains out of anthills here.
    I love the NSA. It's like having a secret fan-base you will never see, but they're there, watching everything you write and it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that I may be some person's only form of unconstitutional entertainment one night.

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    Re: US To Use Drones In Chris Dorner Manhunt

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    With what the police currently have at their command, it makes little sense for operations innate to police practices.
    That is your opinion, however, that's like saying why do police need helicopters. Helicopters have proven invaluable to police especially when chasing down a subject that has eluded the ground units. Sorry, but IMO you are just plain wrong here.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Then the ground patrol officer is sufficient.
    Again, wrong. Helicopters have proven invaluable. Drones are cheaper and can help police officers far better.

    I don't think we are ever going to see eye to eye on this issue, but the as the way the drones will be used, they will be used the same as helicopters with better results.

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