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Thread: Anonymous Threatens Massive WikiLeaks-Style Exposure, Announced On Hacked Gov Site

  1. #141
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    Re: Constrictive Hacking!

    Quote Originally Posted by BigRedChief View Post
    And thats what every Al-Quada and suicide bomber has ever said.
    When you are fighting a war you don't exactly look for the approval of those you are waging war against. You find your cause just and that is really all that matters.

  2. #142
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    Re: Constrictive Hacking!

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    In part, but that is far from all. In modern warfare the goals, tactics and strategies go far beyond conquering territory.
    I realize that, thanks.

    They could have gotten us to leave simply by not fighting.
    How would that work exactly? Why would that be their rational response?

  3. #143
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    Re: Constrictive Hacking!

    Quote Originally Posted by HonestJoe View Post
    This isn't a revolution, it's a minor political disagreement.

    That isn't what I'm saying. I'm saying that blackmailing politicians to corrupt the democratic process is immoral (regardless of whether it is illegal or not). I'm challenging the people who are defending the practice, especially if they're hypocritically defending it only when if favours their personal opinion or is to their benefit. This doesn't only apply to supporters of Anonymous.
    Maybe it's a minor disagreement to you. I see the government fundamentally challenging our liberty in far too many instances to count.

    Were the Boston tea partiers not blackmailing the British government by essentially saying "If you don't change what you're doing, we're going to keep destroying your property and rebel."? Sounds like blackmail to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    I've got to say that it is shadenfreudalicious to see the rich and famous fucquewads on the coast suffering from the fires.

  4. #144
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    Re: Constrictive Hacking!

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    Maybe it's a minor disagreement to you. I see the government fundamentally challenging our liberty in far too many instances to count.

    Were the Boston tea partiers not blackmailing the British government by essentially saying "If you don't change what you're doing, we're going to keep destroying your property and rebel."? Sounds like blackmail to me.
    You make a very good point regarding blackmail.

    In this case however, at least as I understand it, Anonymous is in possession of emails and such that supposedly detail government crimes against the rule of law or individual citizens. Assuming that is correct, it seems to me that Anonymous has some sort of moral obligation to expose those crimes, rather than just offer threats to do so.

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    Re: Constrictive Hacking!

    Quote Originally Posted by Henry David View Post
    You make a very good point regarding blackmail.

    In this case however, at least as I understand it, Anonymous is in possession of emails and such that supposedly detail government crimes against the rule of law or individual citizens. Assuming that is correct, it seems to me that Anonymous has some sort of moral obligation to expose those crimes, rather than just offer threats to do so.
    I don't think at the moment they are interested in showing the crimes, but getting even with the government. They even say as much in the video by saying they want to put the government in the same situation Swartz found himself in.

  6. #146
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    Re: Constrictive Hacking!

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    Maybe it's a minor disagreement to you. I see the government fundamentally challenging our liberty in far too many instances to count.
    You have the option to fight that democratically. You just have to remember that it isn't just about what you think - you need to convince the majority (or at least a significant minority). Anonymous has had to resort to such extreme tactics because, in their fundamental politics, they represent an insignificant minority. The system isn't perfect but that's no excuse to actively make it worse.

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    Were the Boston tea partiers not blackmailing the British government by essentially saying "If you don't change what you're doing, we're going to keep destroying your property and rebel."? Sounds like blackmail to me.
    They were protesting the British Monarchy, an effective dictatorship in America at the time and the system they were opposing. It isn't in any way comparable to anything in the US today.

  7. #147
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    Re: Constrictive Hacking!

    Quote Originally Posted by HonestJoe View Post
    You have the option to fight that democratically. You just have to remember that it isn't just about what you think - you need to convince the majority (or at least a significant minority). Anonymous has had to resort to such extreme tactics because, in their fundamental politics, they represent an insignificant minority. The system isn't perfect but that's no excuse to actively make it worse.

    They were protesting the British Monarchy, an effective dictatorship in America at the time and the system they were opposing. It isn't in any way comparable to anything in the US today.
    In what world do our laws get voted on by a democratic process of the people? Our laws are created by a group of people who campaign on something completely different from their actions. They bicker back and forth, add in pork, and butcher any bit of good the original law might have had. They overwhelmingly support anti-constitutional bills like the NDAA and patriot act, and there's no one to stand up to them. Yeah, you vote once every 4 years, but they all meet the same status quo.

    You're very comfortable doing whatever the government tells you, and anything they declare is both law and morally just. I disagree.
    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    I've got to say that it is shadenfreudalicious to see the rich and famous fucquewads on the coast suffering from the fires.

  8. #148
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    Re: Constrictive Hacking!

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    In what world do our laws get voted on by a democratic process of the people? Our laws are created by a group of people who campaign on something completely different from their actions. They bicker back and forth, add in pork, and butcher any bit of good the original law might have had. They overwhelmingly support anti-constitutional bills like the NDAA and patriot act, and there's no one to stand up to them. Yeah, you vote once every 4 years, but they all meet the same status quo.
    I agree the political system is far from perfect. My solution is to work at improving it. Your solution seems to be supporting people who are actively making it worse, adding even more corruption and anti-democratic processes. You are, by association, celebrating all of the flaws you're complaining about. Of course next time, they might not be promoting something you agree with and you won't have a leg to stand on.

    My point is simple. You're free to argue that the (apparent) principals Anonymous is pushing the right policies that government should enact but that shouldn't prevent you from clearly stating that blackmail and cyber-crime are inappropriate methods to achieve any political aims.

    Alternatively, you could state that you think blackmail and cyber-crime are appropriate methods to achieve political aims and campaign to making them legal (or threaten enough politicians to make it happen).

  9. #149
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    Re: Constrictive Hacking!

    "Idealists foolish enough to throw caution to the winds have advanced mankind and have enriched the world.

    "The political arena leaves one no alternative, one must either be a dunce or a rogue. "

    "The motto should not be: Forgive one another; rather understand one another. "
    -Emma Goldman

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    Re: Constrictive Hacking!

    LOL, that is beyond awesome.

    Yeah guys, Anonymous is EXACTLY like Al-Qaeda. Remember when Al-Qaeda turned the twin towers into an asteroids game?
    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    I've got to say that it is shadenfreudalicious to see the rich and famous fucquewads on the coast suffering from the fires.

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