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Thread: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

  1. #81
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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Says the guy who doesn't give a ****? Forgive me if I don't take your responses, if you would even call them that, seriously.
    Just continue on with that 'but it's good and doctors should ask if you have a gun at home' line... Maybe someone will come along that believes it.
    "nah i think the way cons want to turn this into a political issue is funny though" - Philly Boss

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Of course, why on earth would a doctor care if their mentally unstable patient had guns at home, lol.

    Yes it's their personal property. That doesn't mean it can't be asked about. Don't you think a doctor would ask about your house if you came in with lead poisoning and he though that old lead paint could be the culprit? ****, last time I was at the doctor for an ingrown nail he made sure to ask me about my shoes, which are my personal property.

    It's called a society. If you don't like living in one, move to the woods and rub aloe vera on you when you're sick or hurt. But don't make the rest of us live in a backwards ass country just because can't understand why mentally unstable people having guns could be an important issue.

    The Dr should be as worried about baseball bats, knives and axes... oh wait... that doesnt fit with disarming us against Obamas goon squad...

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    Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    You still are not understanding anything I am saying. So I'm going to list it out as simply as possible and any response form you that does not address them directly, I am not responding to. Because the fact that women use other means and that Japan has a higher rate has exactly nothing to do with my point. Also, your bull**** assertion that I am blaming everything on the gun is entirely wrong. I am saying it is a factor. Along with dozens of other factors. So you can cut that bull**** out right now. I am not making that claim, do not act like I am.

    1. When people have easy access to guns or guns in their home, they are much more likely to commit suicide and do so effectively. Some people use other methods, without doubt, but in this country, guns are the leading cause and provide a very efficient way to do so.
    As evidence I provide the following study:
    Guns in Homes Strongly Associated with Higher Rates of Suicide - April 10, 2007 -2007 Releases - Press Releases - Harvard School of Public Health

    2. Because of point 1, it makes sense that if a doctor feels that patient is suicidal, that they would ask the person, or the persons guardians, about gun ownership, and recommend safety precautions, such as locking them up or handing them over to a loved one, until the person has figured out a way to deal with their current situation.

    Those are my points. The fact that Japan has high rates of suicide does nothing to argue against the facts presented in point 1. Mainly because you can not provide me any evidence that would suggest that suicide rates would not be higher if people in japan had very easy access to guns. You have also not provided evidence showing that suicide attempts are also 5 times higher than our countries. As I have pointed out, one of the reasons guns are a main concern when discussing suicide, is that they result in a 90% success rate, where as pills result in 3% success rate.

    Now with this, I will stipulate that I am not suggesting that doctors should go around suggesting that everyone should get rid of their guns, I am not suggesting people kill themselves simply because they have guns, I am not saying that getting rid of all guns erases all cases of suicide, I am not saying that there are no other ways to commit suicide, and I am not saying that some of the people who commit suicide through the use of guns would not find some other way to commit suicide.

    Now, here's a simple question.

    Show me the proof that Japan's suicide rate wouldn't be any higher if they didn't have the easy access to guns that we have here. I have shown you the study showing how gun ownership in our country relates to suicide (which is the actual topic btw, imagine that?) now show me the proof that Japan's would be higher.

    To liken this to another topic... Lets say I show you that country "x" has a very long life span average, much longer than ours. They also have universal healthcare. Could I then make a blanket statement, as you are here about Japan and suicide rates, that the universal healthcare is obviously better than our system, given that they live longer? Or would I be completely ignoring the possible difference in society, such as maybe they don't have fast food joints on every corner, that they just live healthier lives in general etc...?

    That's right, You would have to take in to account the societal differences. And that is what you are missing on your japan analysis. In fact, suicide rates are all over the place, England has less suicides that us per capita and they have no guns. Regardless, that makes no difference to my argument. Japan having high rates, while it does show that you can commit suicide at high rates without guns, given other factors, it does not show, in ANY way, that doctors talking to patients that could be suicidal about their guns will not have any impact. Given that the studies show that gun ownership is so strongly associated with successful suicide attempts, it makes sense that it would have some kind of a positive impact to have the discussion with patients.
    Dood...seriously. Your initial comment says it all. People use what they have available. That you refuse to see that is mind numbing. The EVIDENCE proves beyond a doubt...take away guns...people STILL kill themselves.

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Meh this is relatively mild.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by BMCM View Post
    Was this before or after Obama told us his plan today? I smell a fairy tale.
    Three or four years ago. This topic has actually been going on for several years. The AMA wanted doctors to start doing this in the middle of the last decade. It was supposedly about safety. Many of us felt it's overboard and information the doctors have no need to know.

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    We should ask ALL questions AND make that information publicly available so people can make wise, safe, and healthy choices.
    Actually in terms of sexual activity and its related risks I was under the impression this was already the case? notifying people at risk of contracting HIV, or gay men and blood donation.
    Anyway sexual history unlike the rest of your list is medically relevant...
    مثلي مثلك

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    Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by L0neW0lf View Post
    Actually in terms of sexual activity and its related risks I was under the impression this was already the case? notifying people at risk of contracting HIV, or gay men and blood donation.
    Anyway sexual history unlike the rest of your list is medically relevant...
    Irrelevant???? No no! We must ask! For the children!!!

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    MD's are now law enforcement.

    I can't wait until our medical records are public... of course... for the good of the nation.
    Under Obamacare for all intents and purposes they are. One need only be a well-connected Democrat and all may be revealed to you.

    WE are doomed.

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by Fishstyx View Post
    Could someone please answer this? WTF does a doctor need to inquire or lecture me on gun safety? I want a doctor to be an expert in diagnosing and treating illness, not firearms! If I want a firearms safety course, I'll take one from someone trained in that field! Feel like I'm taking crazy pills here.

    Whats next, the dentist required to "advise" me about Climate Change?
    That comes after the next crisis.

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    This was proposed two years ago. It makes as much sense to also have doctors ask the kids if mommie or daddy text while driving, eat while driving, put make-up on while driving. It makes as much sense for doctors to ask if the patient is gay and actively engage in sexual activity or if they are heterosexual and practicing safe sex at all times. It makes as much sense as doctors interrogating children to see if there are any unsafe activities in the home. Medical doctors should be able to interrogate the children to see if the parents or guardians are providing them healthy meals, especially those families on welfare. Med doctors should also ask if the family has or allows for the usage of violent video games.

    We should also make sure that we the people have full access to medical records to ensure that the person we are about to sell a car to isn't experiencing or hasn't recently been treated for depression or anxiety. We should be able to check to see if prospective tenants have any type of medical or mental health disorders that might be exclusionary criteria for renting to them (hey...James Holmes turned his apartment into a boobietrap that could have literally killed thousands).


    In turn, patients should interrogate doctors on number of prescriptions they write annually, on if they are ****ing their nurse or administrative assistant, what their latest lab and tox screens show, if they smoke or drink, if they are having any type of sexual relationships outside the bonds of marriage, if they get enough sleep, and what medications they themselves might be taking.

    Look...its one thing if the person is mentally ill or mentally unstable. We do that now. Its quite another thing to ask by routine or matter of course a mentally healthy individual (whatever that really means) personal questions beyond the scope of a routine medical examination.
    I intend to use this. "So Mister V, do you have any weapons at home?" "Well Doc, how many times a week do you sodomize the receptionist?" "How dare you!" "Ditto."

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