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Thread: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

  1. #41
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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    You'd have to present some logic and reason in order for me to ignore it. A baseball bat isn't as dangerous as a gun. For starters I've never heard of anyone committing suicide with a bat. Most gun deaths (something like 65% are suicides). I think that makes it a reasonable question to ask to a person you fear may harm themselves. Sure there are other ways they could go about it, but that gun makes it alot easier and is a much more efficient way to do so, which is the whole point that you fail to grasp.
    Care to guess what the suicide rates are in Japan and how often guns are used to commit suicide there?

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Do you text while driving and if so then you surely dont mind your doctor turning you in to the police for creating a public safety hazard. Do you eat fast food while driving? Same deal. Do you have children? Do you give them sugared cereals? Do you give them sandwiches with processed lunch meat, pre-wrapped cheese, mayonnaise on white bread? Do you let them drink juice or sodas? Do you ensure they receive only healthy foods and make sure they get exercise daily? Any cleaning chemicals left in an unlocked container where they might gain access? If not...should the doctor report you to DCFS (and dont worry...YOU dont have to answer those questions...the doctor can just ask the kids and act based on what responses they get from them).
    The doctor only reports direct threats that have been made. IE: "I am going to and shoot up a building"

    So you can stop with you stupid questions.
    Clarify that no federal law prevents health care providers from warning law enforcement authorities about threats of violence: Doctors and other mental health professionals play an important role in protecting the safety of their patients and the broader community by reporting direct and credible threats of violence to the authorities. But there is public confusion about whether federal law prohibits such reports about threats of violence. The Department of Health and Human Services is issuing a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits these reports in any way.
    Credible threats of violence. Not "habits that could possibly harm yourself". What's the point in even debating this if you still can't grasp what is actually being said?
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    You'd have to present some logic and reason in order for me to ignore it. A baseball bat isn't as dangerous as a gun.
    Oh, you have ignored it, and certainly don't use either.

    As to how dangerous a baseball bat is, I think if this woman wasnt murdered with one, she'd tell you it killed her just as a gun could:

    Kershaw woman 'brutally murdered' with baseball bat - WMBFNews.com, Myrtle Beach/Florence SC, Weather

    Same with the Deltona murder victims...
    "nah i think the way cons want to turn this into a political issue is funny though" - Philly Boss

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Care to guess what the suicide rates are in Japan and how often guns are used to commit suicide there?
    Care to guess what that has to do with our country? Would you argue that the suicide rate over there would be the exact same if there were 300,000,000 guns floating around? I bet quite a bit higher.

    But that's speculation. All be it, my speculation is much better than what ever the hell you're trying to say, but speculation none the less.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Care to guess what that has to do with our country? Would you argue that the suicide rate over there would be the exact same if there were 300,000,000 guns floating around? I bet quite a bit higher.

    But that's speculation. All be it, my speculation is much better than what ever the hell you're trying to say, but speculation none the less.
    What it has to do with ANYTHING is with people like...well...say...YOU making arguments to suit your objectives. Considering their suicide rate is EXTRAORDINARILY higher than ours and they manage to do it quite effectively, I would suggest your causative link of suicide to the availability of guns is ridiculous at best and by evidence, wrong at least.

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by Arbo View Post
    Oh, you have ignored it, and certainly don't use either.

    As to how dangerous a baseball bat is, I think if this woman wasnt murdered with one, she'd tell you it killed her just as a gun could:

    Kershaw woman 'brutally murdered' with baseball bat - WMBFNews.com, Myrtle Beach/Florence SC, Weather

    Same with the Deltona murder victims...
    The fact that it's possible doesn't mean it's nearly on the same level. If it was then we'd issue soldiers louisville sluggers rather than rifles.

    Do me a favor and cut the bull****. Someone being murdered with a baseball bat has nothing to do with he topic. Doctor's can ask about things that can harm you.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Ridiculous at best? When 65% of our suicides are by guns? You can't point to a single country that has high suicide rates with barely any guns and say that that proves that guns don't make suicide much easier to accomplish and make for a very quick and effective method. The more a person has to sit and think about committing suicide, the less likely they are to go through with it. With a gun in hand, you have a quick suicidal thought, you can be over with in seconds, if you had to do it some other way there is planning involved.

    For example:
    Guns in Homes Strongly Associated with Higher Rates of Suicide
    Guns in Homes Strongly Associated with Higher Rates of Suicide - April 10, 2007 -2007 Releases - Press Releases - Harvard School of Public Health

    Now you can continue to ignore the real topic as you wish.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Doctor's can ask about things that can harm you.
    That's the point. If they ask about guns, but don't ask about baseball bats, knives, explosives, etc, then they are concentrating on only one item, and that is wrong. I understand you don't get that, as partisans rarely see outside of their agenda.

    BTW, if someone is so mentally messed up they want to kill themselves and the family doesn't help them, oh f'in well. We have too many problematic people in the world, one less is probably a good thing. Harsh? Hell yeah.
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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    The doctor only reports direct threats that have been made. IE: "I am going to and shoot up a building"

    So you can stop with you stupid questions.


    Credible threats of violence. Not "habits that could possibly harm yourself". What's the point in even debating this if you still can't grasp what is actually being said?
    Not so. If a pediatrician were to find that a child lives in a home where a gun is not locked in a safe, he could easily decide that child is at risk and report it (and some would say it would be their moral obligation to do so). At least...that is the opinion of the American Academy of Pediatrics, and would also fit within CPS mandatory reporting guidelines for unsafe conditions in the home, and a report of neglect.

    "Parents are often not aware that unsafe storage of guns has caused many child injuries and deaths," said Dr. Neal Kaufman, professor of pediatrics and public health at the University of California, Los Angeles Schools of Medicine and Public Health. Pediatricians have a responsibility to identify possible threats to a child's safety and highlight ways parents can lessen those risks, Kaufman said.

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    Re: Obama Asks Doctors to Help Deal With Guns

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Ridiculous at best? When 65% of our suicides are by guns? You can't point to a single country that has high suicide rates with barely any guns and say that that proves that guns don't make suicide much easier to accomplish and make for a very quick and effective method. The more a person has to sit and think about committing suicide, the less likely they are to go through with it. With a gun in hand, you have a quick suicidal thought, you can be over with in seconds, if you had to do it some other way there is planning involved.

    For example:
    Guns in Homes Strongly Associated with Higher Rates of Suicide
    Guns in Homes Strongly Associated with Higher Rates of Suicide - April 10, 2007 -2007 Releases - Press Releases - Harvard School of Public Health

    Now you can continue to ignore the real topic as you wish.
    Yes. Ridiculous at best. EVIDENCE hows that people that are intent on committing acts of self harm WILL commit acts of self harm...be it with a firearms, pills, and other means

    Common methods of suicide are jumping in front of trains, leaping off high places, hanging, or overdosing on medication.[1] Rail companies will charge the families of those who commit suicide a fee depending on the severity of disrupted traffic.[17]

    A newer method, gaining in popularity partly due to publicity from Internet suicide websites,[2] is to use household products to make the poisonous gas hydrogen sulfide. In 2007, only 29 suicides used this gas, but in a span from January to September 2008, 867 suicides resulted from gas poisoning.[18] This method is particularly problematic, as there is high risk of hurting others in the process. After a man who attempted suicide in 2008 by swallowing pesticides was hospitalized, 50 people in the hospital were sickened by the toxic fumes.[19]

    OBTW...Japans suicide rate? Its 250% (5x) higher than that in the US.

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