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Thread: Sandy Hook: Beyond gun control, disease control

  1. #81
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    Re: Sandy Hook: Beyond gun control, disease control

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    your logic is silly If your goal is to tax people most likely to be involved in crime, its not legal gun owners, its black males who were raised in single parent households who dropped out of HS. those three factors are the most reliable predictors of being convicted of a felony
    Okay. So what do black males buy that's essential to being a black male, in the way that buying ammunition is essential to being a gun owner, that could be taxed?

    Do you propose a do-rag tax, TurtleDude?
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    Re: Sandy Hook: Beyond gun control, disease control

    Quote Originally Posted by Einzige View Post
    Neither were the Columbine shooters. Someone bought their guns for them illegally. But in both cases it's possible - not inevitable, but inevitability isn't necessary in either case - that more expensive ammunition would have prevented both actions.

    I'm not thrilled with the idea of a gunpowder tax. But if we're to pay for gun violence prevention and mental health coverage with an eye towards preventing gun violence, then the idea I've proposed is, by far, the fairest: let those who are most likely to engage in violent behavior pay for preventing that behavior.

    Gun owners, their bloviating to the contrary, have gotten off very well in this nation. I'm not interested in changing that. I do think that they have a responsibility to themselves, however, to ensure that their own community no longer suffers scapegoating. They can do this by paying a little more for their ammunition, and by doing so without pretending that they're being martyred.
    Buying "favor", to avoid scapegoating, should not be necessary at all. Thank you for your concern, for the gun owners, all the same.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Sandy Hook: Beyond gun control, disease control

    Quote Originally Posted by Jryan View Post
    I tend to agree with your OP's argument. Just like other things, you pay for what you get via taxes. Sorry pals but guns do kill people and us non-gun owners shouldn't have to be reprimanded. If you want to buy a gun, you should have to pay for the POTENTIAL blowback.

    EDIT: and I'm sure there is a figure that could be added to gun tax for violence like this.
    I would much prefer a gun crime tax, since that is what we really seek to prevent. Perhaps using a $10,000 per gun crime figure as a good start.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Sandy Hook: Beyond gun control, disease control

    I think you ascribe humans with grater capacity than they really have. I can see the huge bureaucracy that would grow up around this. The appeals. The "favors for friends". The "ones who got away". The unfairly accused. All in the name of a safe society. We can't even get these stupid humans to use their turn signals, let alone judge the mental projection of others.

    I'm not arguing with you. I understand that you visualize something good. I'm just being my typical, pessimistic self.

    Respect.



    Quote Originally Posted by Fisher View Post
    They don't make the determination. The school does. Teachers and faculty should be personally liable for not reporting someone with mental illness and violent tendencies if the come back and shoot up the place to the database. We could have a process where the mentally ill get their gun rights back when they are older if they can show themselves better similar to felons in those states that take gun rights away and federally. Every time one of these shootings happens just about, we learn after the fact that there were plenty of warning signs and that the person did not just snap. If you have a better way to address the preventative identification and alienation of the dangerous people before the bodies pile up independent of guns, I am all ears. I mean I read story once where a nut in Canada killed and practically decapitated a guy with a knife on a bus for no apparent reason. Systemic change requires we do more than put a band-aid on the issue and pat ourselves on the back.

  5. #85
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    Re: Sandy Hook: Beyond gun control, disease control

    I was listening to a radio pundit and his caller describing how violent video games are to blame for the recent shootings. Most of their argument was based on the idea that shootings like the one at Newtown are something new.

    Are they?

    It seems to me that massacres have been a part of human history for a very long time now.


    What do you think? Is this sort of thing a new phenomenon? Could violent video games be partially to blame?
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Sandy Hook: Beyond gun control, disease control

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    I would much prefer a gun crime tax, since that is what we really seek to prevent. Perhaps using a $10,000 per gun crime figure as a good start.
    Gun crime tax? Care to explain? I don't want to strawman your argument.
    I'm coming to see that no matter what law we regulate, be it the stand your ground act, there is never an objective morally right answer to any morale question; in fact, since there are multiple objectively right answers to every moral question that leaves us with a lot of grey area and a lot of black area (not in the racial since).
    -Jryan

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    Re: Sandy Hook: Beyond gun control, disease control

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    I was listening to a radio pundit and his caller describing how violent video games are to blame for the recent shootings. Most of their argument was based on the idea that shootings like the one at Newtown are something new.

    Are they?

    It seems to me that massacres have been a part of human history for a very long time now.


    What do you think? Is this sort of thing a new phenomenon? Could violent video games be partially to blame?
    I suspect that there is a component of video game effects which could influence certain people to react in a violent way. It really depends on the individual's ability to separate fantasy from reality.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
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    Re: Sandy Hook: Beyond gun control, disease control

    Quote Originally Posted by Jryan View Post
    Gun crime tax? Care to explain? I don't want to strawman your argument.
    Simply a federal tax (fee/fine) imposed on anyone convicted of using a gun during the commision of a crime; as part of a "mandatory minimum" sentence for that crime.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  9. #89
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    Re: Sandy Hook: Beyond gun control, disease control

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    the citizens of California, NYC and NJ are calling you a liar..

    and yes we should be able to buy full automatic rifles easily. They are clearly protected by the second amendment
    How are fully automatic rifles protected by the second amendment? I see no such language in the second amendment granting the right to own fully automatic rifles.

  10. #90
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    Re: Sandy Hook: Beyond gun control, disease control

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    I suspect that there is a component of video game effects which could influence certain people to react in a violent way. It really depends on the individual's ability to separate fantasy from reality.
    As I recall, it has been shown that those video games desensitize people to killing. Military trainers have seen recruits unable to shoot targets even when people around them are being maimed or killed by opposition fire. so some of the training is designed to eliminate the inhibitions of firing on other people. those video games are similar to that training

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