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Thread: Richest\Poorest Cities in USA

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    Re: Richest\Poorest Cities in USA

    Ah but it doesn't already happen; the money isn't getting to the poor cities and the rich cities just get richer and richer - yeah I'm being snarky and thanks for not bittiing my head off for it. I think its imperative to point out the double standard. People want to soak the rich but its ok for rich cities to have these big budgets and not give to the poor cities? Why the double standard?



    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    And that's the way the current tax structure already works (sort of, without all the nuance). I understand that you're trying to be snarky, but you're basically being snarky about something that literally already happens.

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    Re: Richest\Poorest Cities in USA

    Quote Originally Posted by CalGun View Post
    Ah but it doesn't already happen; the money isn't getting to the poor cities and the rich cities just get richer and richer - yeah I'm being snarky and thanks for not bittiing my head off for it. I think its imperative to point out the double standard. People want to soak the rich but its ok for rich cities to have these big budgets and not give to the poor cities? Why the double standard?
    Because A) the article isn't really about the city's budget, it's about the median income, B) cities with high median incomes are contributing to the welfare of cities with low median income through the medium of income taxes, C) the goal of progressive taxation really isn't to make everyone equally wealthy, it's to provide basic services for the people who are most at risk of just falling out of society completely (we could argue about how good a job the government does with this - there are definitely valid arguments that it kind of sucks at the moment), and to - as best as possible - ensure that people have relatively equal access to opportunities for self-growth and upward mobility, which leads to conclusion D) there is no double standard.

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    Re: Richest\Poorest Cities in USA

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    OK, but I still think you place way too much emphasis on racism, a view not found in any of my links to be the "major cause" of the economic decline of Detroit, although I am sure that it played some part, thus the race riots. Many cities have had far worse racial problems but not nearly as bad of economic outcomes.
    I am at work and can only post here for a minute or two..... I went round and round on this a year or two ago with Rev HH and posted lots of great stuff showing a strong measurable relationship between self admitted white racism and white flight. Its here somewhere but right now I just do not have the time to search for it today.

    For what its worth - and this is my opinion - Detroit (where I was born) is very different in white attitudes than many other big northern cities like Chicago. In Chicago, many white ethnics fought to keep their neighborhoods and it became a cause celebre for them to do so. In Detroit, whites could not get out fast enough.

    We are in the last days of a lame duck legislature here and I am putting in 12 hour days so I will try to locate the material in a couple days..... unless someone finds it first.
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    Re: Richest\Poorest Cities in USA

    Quote Originally Posted by CalGun View Post
    You know I was looking at this and wondering why we don't impose a tax on the top 5 and give it to the bottom 5? I mean come on we want "fairness" right?
    DC made the top 5 because that's where the taxes go.
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

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    Re: Richest\Poorest Cities in USA

    But you are putting it back on the person - I'm talking cities:
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------
    Detroit budget 1.12 billion
    706,000 people = $1,586 a person

    San Francisco $6.8 billion budget
    812,000 = $8,374 per person

    Now clearly SF being a top 5 needs to share with Detroit – just saying.



    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    Because A) the article isn't really about the city's budget, it's about the median income, B) cities with high median incomes are contributing to the welfare of cities with low median income through the medium of income taxes, C) the goal of progressive taxation really isn't to make everyone equally wealthy, it's to provide basic services for the people who are most at risk of just falling out of society completely (we could argue about how good a job the government does with this - there are definitely valid arguments that it kind of sucks at the moment), and to - as best as possible - ensure that people have relatively equal access to opportunities for self-growth and upward mobility, which leads to conclusion D) there is no double standard.

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    Re: Richest\Poorest Cities in USA

    Here in Philadelphia (#2), it was middle class people getting married and having kids. Those kids moved to the suburbs and over time, as the older folks moved away from their nice neighborhoods as well and those neighborhoods progressively got worse and single parent families grew more common. The slide continues.

    Now there are areas that I know to not even try to drive in because that is where the crime is. Many areas are still ok and some areas are still damn nice. Now areas are being torn down and higher rent yuppie pads are going up attracking young people who want to live in the city.

    Is it race? I don't know. Haymarket has some study or such which says that it is. I guess it is racist to want to live on an acre of land rather than one of 8 connected row homes. I guess it is racist to want your neighbors to have pride in their home and take care of their property.

    Philadelphia is an underrated city but it does have it's challenges. We have a culture in the city where calling the police is "snitching" and frowned upon--even over the death of a child. What makes it different from Detroit? It is easier to cross the river to another state rather than another country (amazing how clean Windsor is). The suburbs of Philadelphia are much more affluent than the suburbs of Detroit. There are many more prestigious colleges and universities in Philly than Detroit. Pennsylvania has a flat state income tax and only two real big cities. Detroit is it in Michigan which has no other big cities. All of Philly's sports teams have always played in the city giving a year round opportunity to go to the city to take in a game.

    2/3 of Pennsylvania hates Philly while 90% of Michigan hates Detroit.

    On and on.

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    Re: Richest\Poorest Cities in USA

    Quote Originally Posted by CalGun View Post
    But you are putting it back on the person - I'm talking cities:
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------
    Detroit budget 1.12 billion
    706,000 people = $1,586 a person

    San Francisco $6.8 billion budget
    812,000 = $8,374 per person

    Now clearly SF being a top 5 needs to share with Detroit – just saying.
    I get that, but what I'm pointing out (right now) is that when the article's talking about SF being the 2nd richest city, it's not talking about the city budget, it's talking about the median income of the people who live there. In either case, taxation is always ultimately a function of individual wealth, rather than the city-wide aggregate. That money (city, state, or federal budget) isn't coming from cities, it's coming from individual residents of cities. So residents of SF are sharing with Detroit, and there's still enough left over to fund a higher city budget (not surprising, given the income disparity and the fact that SF is one of the few cities that has its own income tax).

    You could also look at this from the other direction. You've got a point re: per capita budgets, but you've also got to think about regional costs. I guarantee you that the salaries of SF government employees are way the hell higher than in Detroit. The cost of living here is higher than anywhere except maybe Manhattan (at least as far as urban areas go - there are definitely small towns up and down the California coast with higher median house prices, e.g.). So while the per capita budget of SF may be roughly five times what it is in Detroit, the cost of doing business here (in any capacity) is also quite a lot higher.

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    Re: Richest\Poorest Cities in USA

    Modest proposal, all persons of IQ 80 or less would be eligible for
    a voluntary sterilization program. Strictly voluntary with a trust of
    5K or $10K held in trust for a few year. Very cost effective and a saver
    of so much human suffering.

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    Re: Richest\Poorest Cities in USA

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    DC made the top 5 because that's where the taxes go.
    Dc is a huge city with plenty of private industry, a great public transportation system, a corrupt but well functioning city government, and a diverse population, a great deal of higher education, a free zoo, with effing pandas, our own lgbt paper, the coolest flag of any state, etc

    We have plenty going for us, there is a lot more to us than being the capital.

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    Re: Richest\Poorest Cities in USA

    Quote Originally Posted by hikari View Post
    Dc is a huge city with plenty of private industry, a great public transportation system, a corrupt but well functioning city government, and a diverse population, a great deal of higher education, a free zoo, with effing pandas, our own lgbt paper, the coolest flag of any state, etc

    We have plenty going for us, there is a lot more to us than being the capital.
    Yeah, well the Bay Area's got you beat twice over on the list. So take THAT DC. (Kidding... more or less)

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