Page 3 of 23 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 226

Thread: SCOTUS: Scalia on the defensive over gay rights

  1. #21
    Global Moderator
    Rage More!
    Your Star's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    26,362

    Re: Justice Scalia compares homosexuality to murder.

    Quote Originally Posted by RepublicanMcDuc View Post
    That's a bit hard to do seeing as it was Scalia that authored the majority opinion striking down the law.
    Ahh **** that was Thomas, my bad. But still, it's not hard to confuse the two, they both say some stupid ****.
    Eat me, drink me, love me;
    Laura make much of me

  2. #22
    Educator falcata's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    North East Pennsylvania
    Last Seen
    08-10-17 @ 11:16 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Left
    Posts
    926

    Re: Justice Scalia compares homosexuality to murder.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    He's not comparing homosexuality with murder.
    He added, If we cannot have moral feelings against homosexuality, can we have it against murder? Can we have it against other things?"
    It's pretty clear that he is refering to it negatively here, at least close if not on par wih murder.
    I traveled with Ivanka
    the way I normally do
    How was I to know
    She was with the Russians too? - Poetics by TurtleDude

  3. #23
    long standing member
    justabubba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:23 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    36,156

    Re: Justice Scalia compares homosexuality to murder.

    can't stand scalia
    he is an embarrassment to the court (as is thomas)
    neither should be found ethical

    that said, i do not see what is newsworthy about scalia's comment:
    Speaking at Princeton University, Scalia was asked by a gay student why he equates laws banning sodomy with those barring bestiality and murder. I don't think it's necessary, but I think it's effective, Scalia said, adding that legislative bodies can ban what they believe to be immoral.
    He added, If we cannot have moral feelings against homosexuality, can we have it against murder? Can we have it against other things?"
    there are those who still view sexual activity outside of marriage as immoral
    those who believe it is immoral not to attend church
    many believe that those of different races should not marry and should not have bi-/multi-racial children
    and there are those who believe sodomy remains immoral
    just as they believe bestiality and murder are immoral

    in short, scalia offered an honest, direct answer to a pointed question

    still can't stand the corrupt bastard, however
    and cannot share turtledude's assessment that this bastard possesses a brilliant intellect. have witnessed no indication of that being true
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

  4. #24
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Last Seen
    09-18-16 @ 03:33 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    12,029

    Re: Justice Scalia compares homosexuality to murder.

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    I know you are an attorney and I accept your thoughts and respect them. Is Scalia brilliant and well-versed? Yes. Is he a total right-wing asshole? Yes.
    I disagree that he's "brilliant". He's an intellectual thug who can't make arguments based on thoughtful merits. Which is why he constantly makes invidious comparisons like he just did between gays and murderers.

    The comparison shows a dull intellect that can't make distinctions between moral judgments that have a basis in the rights of others, and moral judgments that merely involve prejudice and hate.

    Murder harms the rights of others, so making moral judgments about murder is warranted, even putting aside the social policies we want concering dissuading violence. Sexual orientation isn't remotely like that. It's the same as Scalia saying: can't we make laws embodying racists moral judgment that black people are bad and need to be oppressed.

    A normal intelligent person understands there is a category error here. But Scalia is just a conservative hack who can't think straight.
    Last edited by head of joaquin; 12-11-12 at 07:04 PM.

  5. #25
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Last Seen
    09-18-16 @ 03:33 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    12,029

    Re: Justice Scalia compares homosexuality to murder.

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    can't stand scalia
    he is an embarrassment to the court (as is thomas)
    neither should be found ethical

    that said, i do not see what is newsworthy about scalia's comment:


    there are those who still view sexual activity outside of marriage as immoral
    those who believe it is immoral not to attend church
    many believe that those of different races should not marry and should not have bi-/multi-racial children
    and there are those who believe sodomy remains immoral
    just as they believe bestiality and murder are immoral

    in short, scalia offered an honest, direct answer to a pointed question

    still can't stand the corrupt bastard, however
    and cannot share turtledude's assessment that this bastard possesses a brilliant intellect. have witnessed no indication of that being true
    You're correct that there is an "argument" is his rather ugly comparison relating to morality and the law that is a genuine issue. I guess the response would be that the comparison is invidious and he is making a category error comparing sexual orientation and murder.

    The former doesn't harm anybody, despite one's "moral" feelings about it. The other does cause harm to others, so the moral odiousness of it is based not in bias, but the positive emotion of wanting to protect people.

    So he is "technically" making an argument about morality and the law, but instead of arguing on the merits used an inapt and invidious comparison. It's typical of him becuase he is a hack.

  6. #26
    Guru
    Samhain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Northern Ohio
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 12:34 PM
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    3,888

    Re: Justice Scalia compares homosexuality to murder.

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    I respectfully disagree. Seems to be used that way.

    “If we cannot have moral feelings against homosexuality, can we have it against murder? Can we have it against other things?"
    No, he's musing about the concept of morality, and how we can apply morality in our lives and laws. One person's moral opinion does not equal all.

  7. #27
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Last Seen
    09-18-16 @ 03:33 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    12,029

    Re: Justice Scalia compares homosexuality to murder.

    Quote Originally Posted by Samhain View Post
    No, he's musing about the concept of morality, and how we can apply morality in our lives and laws. One person's moral opinion does not equal all.
    Then he shouldn't have used murder to compare with, since it is a category of conduct that not only can be morally odious, but actually harms other people. It isn't just a question of being biased against murderers.

    Moral judgements about sexual orientation aren't like that.

    So if he wanted to make an argument on the merits about using morality in the law (and such an argument can be made), then he should have compared anti-gay laws to Jim Crow or other outrageously discriminatory laws.

    But of course that doesn't serve his conservative agenda.

  8. #28
    Sage
    clownboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Oregon
    Last Seen
    08-17-16 @ 10:31 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    26,087

    Re: Justice Scalia compares homosexuality to murder.

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    Anyone who can compare homosexuality to murder, or justifying using the state to judge, rate, and block business's from selling video games(Why is he not a statist for supporting that?) based on mid-1600 parenting techniques is a dumbass. Sorry, it's just the truth.
    See post #14. Typical biased reframe of what he said.

  9. #29
    Discount Philosopher
    specklebang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Las Vegas
    Last Seen
    06-05-14 @ 08:26 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    11,524

    Re: Justice Scalia compares homosexuality to murder.

    Equating homosexuality with evil or immorality is vile. I happen to be a huge advocate of morality but not the type of morality Scalia espouses. Sorry, I'll go with Head Of Joaquim on this one even though I rarely agree with him on other topics.

    He's an intellectual thug who can make arguments based on thoughtful merits. Which is why he constantly makes invidious comparison like he just did between gays and murderers.

    The comparison shows a dull intellect that can't make distinctions between moral judgments that have a basis in the rights of others, and moral judgments that merely involve prejudice and hate.

    Murder harms the rights of others, so making moral judgments about murder is warranted, even putting aside the social policies we want concering dissuading violence. Sexual orientation isn't remotely like that. It's the same as Scalia saying: can't we make laws embodying racists moral judgment that black people are bad and need to be oppressed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Samhain View Post
    No, he's musing about the concept of morality, and how we can apply morality in our lives and laws. One person's moral opinion does not equal all.

  10. #30
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    The anals of history
    Last Seen
    07-25-15 @ 02:05 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    10,348

    Re: Justice Scalia compares homosexuality to murder.

    The subject is "moral feelings," not homosexuality, murder, or "other things."

    He is saying that as one can have moral feelings about a number of things, murder being one, one can have moral feelings about homosexuality as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    I respectfully disagree. Seems to be used that way.

    If we cannot have moral feelings against homosexuality, can we have it against murder? Can we have it against other things?"

Page 3 of 23 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •