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Thread: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    I don't know what is worse...that the Obama Administration seems to believe that it can order the extrajudicial killings of American citizens without any trial (or even any good reason), or that no one seems to care about it. It's hard to imagine an executive power that has more potential for abuse than this...and yet astonishingly, there seems to be a widespread bipartisan consensus that secret "kill lists" are A-OK.
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    How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Let's take a look at the bigger picture, here. Drone strikes do not suddenly, magically give the Executive Branch the power (not necessarily legal, but de facto) to kill anyone on the planet at a whim; the President already has that power by merit of his position as Commander in Chief. Before drones, he/she would have ordered an assassin with a regular old M40 to post up behind the target and kill him/her; in other words, the Drone is only another part of an already large and effective arsenal that is at the President's disposal.

    All moral and legal issues aside, then, all that is occurring is the forward march of technology enabling different methods of killing. Moreover, this sixteen year old's death is nothing new when compared to some of the brutality inflicted on unarmed, fully surrendered SS Troops by American paratroopers during WWII or the people of Dresden by British bomber pilots after it.

    Again, if we put aside our moral lenses, what this sixteen-year-old boy's death shows is that war is still a dirty, dangerous, unpredictable affair in which plenty of 'good' people die and plenty of 'bad' people live fulfilling lives of 'Evil'-- on both sides, no less.

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Well, his father certainly was. No evidence has been presented that the son was involved in any plots against the United States. So far, the Obama Administration won't even make an unsubstantiated CLAIM that he was.
    After reading through the post and the article, I have a question. The article points out he was killed by a drone strike, however, it never actually says he was the target of the drone strike. It may lead you to think that, but doesn't say it outright.

    Was he the intended target of the strike or was he collateral damage when the drone struck at another target?
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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by sharon View Post
    Papa Al-Alawki had renounced his US citizenship.

    While Its unfortunte the boy was killed, what was he doing in Yemen?
    I believe the means of removing citizenship is much more complex than many people make out when discussing this case. Second, I am unsure how that would relate to the question of his child

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    I am as liberal as any lib on this board and I have no problem saying that when it comes to the horrid practice pf drone strikes, particularly signature strikes, Obama is orders of magnitude worse than Bush was. Bush was certainly worse in other areas, but when it comes to wonton use of the drones, the Obama administration reigns supreme.

    For every actual terrorist we kill with them I wonder how many we create?

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarcogito View Post
    I am as liberal as any lib on this board and I have no problem saying that when it comes to the horrid practice pf drone strikes, particularly signature strikes, Obama is orders of magnitude worse than Bush was. Bush was certainly worse in other areas, but when it comes to wonton use of the drones, the Obama administration reigns supreme.

    For every actual terrorist we kill with them I wonder how many we create?
    I am not a liberal, nor a conservative for that matter, but I have to agree that in many, many cases, drones strikes are a bad idea.
    Only a fool measures equality by results and not opportunities.

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    This is quite the conundrum. On one hand, I absolutely support the use of drones to take out terror targets. On another hand...well...I have a really hard time caring all that much about terrorist affiliates. On yet another hand I couldnt give a good damn if the targets are 6 or 16 if they are actual terror targets and I could care FAR less if they are Americans in Yemen. Missiles from drones dont stop and ask for ID, nor do they have a divert and self destruct guidance system when the targets are minors. I would love to give blanket support of the Obama administration for continuing the war against terrorists. And yet...

    There is nothing to indicate that the targets of this specific attack were actually terror targets. Thats a bit bothersome. And Gibbs glib remarks sound like any and every typical kneejerk Obama supporter that excuses justifies and rationalizes any and every act done by Obama. The comment 'he should have picked a better daddy implies the attack was justified not because they were actual targets but because his father was. That would be the equivalent of a SWAT team kicking in the door of a known gang bangers house and killing him, then, two weeks later going in and killing his teenage son for no other reason than his daddy was a known gang banger.

    My problem is (if I'm being honest) that I REALLY have a hard time getting very worked up about terror targets being taken out in Yemen. If most people are honest, Id say that is truly what it comes down to. Its not a whole lot different than the people that get a raging hard-on over the thought of protesting GITMO but not giving half a damn about the administrations use of black ops prisons in the ME. Everyone has a little bit of hypocrite in them.

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by DVSentinel View Post
    After reading through the post and the article, I have a question. The article points out he was killed by a drone strike, however, it never actually says he was the target of the drone strike. It may lead you to think that, but doesn't say it outright.

    Was he the intended target of the strike or was he collateral damage when the drone struck at another target?
    We do not know. The Obama Administration will neither confirm nor deny that he was the intended target, except to say that he "should have had a more responsible father." As far as I'm concerned that's an unsatisfactory answer; we shouldn't just take it on the president's word (even if he were to make such a statement).
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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    We do not know. The Obama Administration will neither confirm nor deny that he was the intended target, except to say that he "should have had a more responsible father." As far as I'm concerned that's an unsatisfactory answer; we shouldn't just take it on the president's word (even if he were to make such a statement).
    I see. Not that I needed another excuse, because next Tuesday I intended to vote to fire the current President anyways, now I just have one more item on a very long list of reasons to get rid of Obama. I never liked the drone policy to begin with and definitely haven't liked his expansion of it.

    Using drones to strike individuals, besides the increased collateral damage, is too heavily reliant on good intelligence and our track record on that is not very good.
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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Penguin View Post
    Let's take a look at the bigger picture, here. Drone strikes do not suddenly, magically give the Executive Branch the power (not necessarily legal, but de facto) to kill anyone on the planet at a whim; the President already has that power by merit of his position as Commander in Chief. Before drones, he/she would have ordered an assassin with a regular old M40 to post up behind the target and kill him/her; in other words, the Drone is only another part of an already large and effective arsenal that is at the President's disposal.

    All moral and legal issues aside, then, all that is occurring is the forward march of technology enabling different methods of killing. Moreover, this sixteen year old's death is nothing new when compared to some of the brutality inflicted on unarmed, fully surrendered SS Troops by American paratroopers during WWII or the people of Dresden by British bomber pilots after it.

    Again, if we put aside our moral lenses, what this sixteen-year-old boy's death shows is that war is still a dirty, dangerous, unpredictable affair in which plenty of 'good' people die and plenty of 'bad' people live fulfilling lives of 'Evil'-- on both sides, no less.

    -Duxwing
    Are you serious?

    He has already done, many times and for a few years now, what you describe as "giving him the power". The really old timers had a word for it, usurp or usurpation of powers. That's how long it's been around--tyrants claiming the right to kill anybody for anything, once they devise the sophistry.

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