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Thread: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    Bro the planks of the party are generally decided by the most extreme elements. Does the Republican party planks represent all of your views?
    1) I am not a republican

    2) Yes, there are many issues that dominate the majority of republicans


    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    I'm also in no way a dove when it comes to foreign policy despite your belief that EVERYBODY! that's a liberal must be anti-war.
    I never claimed that every liberal thought a certain way, what I did claim was that opposition to these things under Bush was more wide scale and visible. Which it was

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
    Sorry, "the apple doesn't fall far from the tree" is not a legal doctrine by which the United States of America should operate. At the very least there needs to be EVIDENCE of some wrongdoing...hell, the Obama Administration can't even bring themselves to ACCUSE him of any wrongdoing. And is there any reason this shouldn't be routed through a federal judge? Why do you think the president can be trusted to be the sole judge, jury, and executioner of American citizens?
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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    I don't know what is worse...that the Obama Administration seems to believe that it can order the extrajudicial killings of American citizens without any trial (or even any good reason), or that no one seems to care about it. It's hard to imagine an executive power that has more potential for abuse than this...and yet astonishingly, there seems to be a widespread bipartisan consensus that secret "kill lists" are A-OK.

    I'm not a huge fan of violence or mindless killing and I'm not condoning it but honestly, the kid probably shouldn't have been hanging around with recognized terrorists in a country that the US had been warning Americans to get out of for the previous year leading up to his death in 2011.

    It sounds like the US was targeting Ibrahim al-Banna (also reported dead in that strike). From what I've read he was considered to be one of the most dangerous al-qaeda operatives in Yemen, "who was wanted internationally for "planning attacks both inside and outside Yemen"."

    BBC News - Deadly protests erupt in Yemen capital Sanaa


    The Atlantic is about a year late with their outrage over this I wonder why...
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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Monserrat View Post
    I'm not a huge fan of violence or mindless killing and I'm not condoning it but honestly, the kid probably shouldn't have been hanging around with recognized terrorists in a country that the US had been warning Americans to get out of for the previous year leading up to his death in 2011.

    It sounds like the US was targeting Ibrahim al-Banna (also reported dead in that strike). From what I've read he was considered to be one of the most dangerous al-qaeda operatives in Yemen, "who was wanted internationally for "planning attacks both inside and outside Yemen"."

    BBC News - Deadly protests erupt in Yemen capital Sanaa


    The Atlantic is about a year late with their outrage over this I wonder why...
    the Atlantic has been generating press on the issue since it developed

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Monserrat View Post
    I'm not a huge fan of violence or mindless killing and I'm not condoning it but honestly, the kid probably shouldn't have been hanging around with recognized terrorists in a country that the US had been warning Americans to get out of for the previous year leading up to his death in 2011.

    It sounds like the US was targeting Ibrahim al-Banna (also reported dead in that strike). From what I've read he was considered to be one of the most dangerous al-qaeda operatives in Yemen, "who was wanted internationally for "planning attacks both inside and outside Yemen"."

    BBC News - Deadly protests erupt in Yemen capital Sanaa


    The Atlantic is about a year late with their outrage over this I wonder why...
    It sounds like you're condoning it. It sounds like you are blaming the dead man for hanging out with the 'wrong' people.

    Rationalizing illegal government behavior is a form of condoning it, IMO.

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Henry David View Post
    It sounds like you're condoning it. It sounds like you are blaming the dead man for hanging out with the 'wrong' people.

    Rationalizing illegal government behavior is a form of condoning it, IMO.
    I believe in some level of personal responsibility. We're not talking about a kid getting caught with the wrong crowd at say a high school party, we're talking about a 16 year old in a country where the US had made it very clear that they could not guarantee the safety of American citizens and urged all Americans in that country to leave. The government was not targeting a 16 year old American in Yemen they were targeting other very dangerous people who he was with, who we declared war against and have been fighting against for quite some time now.

    So no I'm not condoning what happened but I'm not going to just blame the US for everything that goes wrong in the world especially in this case when they spent a year warning Americans that their lives were in danger if they remained in that country.
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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Monserrat View Post
    I believe in some level of personal responsibility. We're not talking about a kid getting caught with the wrong crowd at say a high school party, we're talking about a 16 year old in a country where the US had made it very clear that they could not guarantee the safety of American citizens and urged all Americans in that country to leave. The government was not targeting a 16 year old American in Yemen they were targeting other very dangerous people who he was with, who we declared war against and have been fighting against for quite some time now.

    So no I'm not condoning what happened but I'm not going to just blame the US for everything that goes wrong in the world especially in this case when they spent a year warning Americans that their lives were in danger if they remained in that country.
    I understand your point about personal responsibility.

    However, the larger point is the rule of law. The government is commanded by its founding document to follow due process before depriving anyone of liberty or life. It did neither.

    The federal government is clearly in violation of both US law and international law. The federal government cannot tell the citizen with whom he must associate or not associate.

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Papa Al-Alawki had renounced his US citizenship.

    While Its unfortunte the boy was killed, what was he doing in Yemen?

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    How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Let's take a look at the bigger picture, here. Drone strikes do not suddenly, magically give the Executive Branch the power (not necessarily legal, but de facto) to kill anyone on the planet at a whim; the President already has that power by merit of his position as Commander in Chief. Before drones, he/she would have ordered an assassin with a regular old M40 to post up behind the target and kill him/her; in other words, the Drone is only another part of an already large and effective arsenal that is at the President's disposal.

    All moral and legal issues aside, then, all that is occurring is the forward march of technology enabling different methods of killing. Moreover, this sixteen year old's death is nothing new when compared to some of the brutality inflicted on unarmed, fully surrendered SS Troops by American paratroopers during WWII or the people of Dresden by British bomber pilots after it.

    Again, if we put aside our moral lenses, what this sixteen-year-old boy's death shows is that war is still a dirty, dangerous, unpredictable affair in which plenty of 'good' people die and plenty of 'bad' people live fulfilling lives of 'Evil'-- on both sides, no less.

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    I don't know what is worse...that the Obama Administration seems to believe that it can order the extrajudicial killings of American citizens without any trial (or even any good reason), or that no one seems to care about it. It's hard to imagine an executive power that has more potential for abuse than this...and yet astonishingly, there seems to be a widespread bipartisan consensus that secret "kill lists" are A-OK.
    Next question I have is, why isn't someone being charged with homicide, for killing him?
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