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Thread: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    You mean a war with a country with no WMD's? I would argue that the number of Americans KIA and wounded in Iraq and the cost of the war in Iraq are pretty big deals but whatever.
    no, like tapping phones, renditions, etc. Not sure how you read into that support for the Iraq war, or confuse such as a claim that Bush didn't deserve to be criticized for anything


    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    It's not excuse making. This thread isn't about hypocrisy in politics. I just find it interesting that you think this is some major issue and seem to ignore the fact it happens all the time.
    Yes it is, when it's clear that opposition to Bush's attempt to collect executive power and his abuse of civil rights was central to left wing politics during that time


    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    For individuals that drone attacks and GITMO were important to....it's still important.
    you could have fooled me ...


    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    That was my previous point. Conservative does not mean "screaming bloody hell over abortions". Just like Liberal doesn't mean everyone has one view on drone attacks and the killing of US citizens.
    uhh, the issue is pretty central to conservative politics in this country, and certainly eye brows would be raised if a majority of that group came out in support of abortions

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    So you're saying we see the same amount of opposition to phone tapping under Bush as we see of Obama's drone strikes?

    LOL

    Repulsive progressive hypocrisy - Salon.com
    No I'm saying tribalism is a human trait not a partisan trait. I'm saying that individuals that feel very strongly about the issue haven't shifted but it was used as a bludgeon by individuals on the left against Bush that really didnt' care that much. Just like how Republicans use median income and poverty rates against Obama when in power they don't give 2 ****s about either metric.

    Actually the Liberals that "support killing US citizen via drone attacks" I would guess are a lot like you. You seem kind of like a partisan hack who would shift views based on whose in the White House. You exhibit the same identity politics/tribalism style views you would expect.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post

    1) where did I claim you were deflecting? I said you were insane for suggesting that support was always bipartisan, because opposition to such programs under Bush defined liberalism in this country for many years
    You didn't, but it was said

    Quote Originally Posted by tech30528 View Post
    Theeeeere it is. It took all the way to the end of the page to deflect to Bush. WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT BUSH. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT OBAMA AND DRONE STRIKES.
    2) My point, again, was that the issue only became bipartisan when a democrat entered the white house.
    Very true.



    again, where is the right currently taking issue with it? For the two situations to be analogies the right would have to largely reject the policy under Obama, and only start supporting it when he left office
    There's plenty of Bush-era holdovers that have been jumped on by hyper-partisans. For example Guantanamo, and at some point Iraq and Afghanistan became "Obama's wars" though he started neither of them.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    No I'm saying tribalism is a human trait not a partisan trait. I'm saying that individuals that feel very strongly about the issue haven't shifted but it was used as a bludgeon by individuals on the left against Bush that really didnt' care that much. Just like how Republicans use median income and poverty rates against Obama when in power they don't give 2 ****s about either metric.
    lol, but in one case we are talking about the US govt blowing up one of it's very own citizens.

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    Actually the Liberals that "support killing US citizen via drone attacks" I would guess are a lot like you. You seem kind of like a partisan hack who would shift views based on whose in the White House. You exhibit the same identity politics/tribalism style views you would expect.
    lol. Cognitive dissonance must be a bitch. But no, I always saw the issue as rather complex (open to debate), but always side with caution on issues concerning civil liberties

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    There's plenty of Bush-era holdovers that have been jumped on by hyper-partisans. For example Guantanamo, and at some point Iraq and Afghanistan became "Obama's wars" though he started neither of them.
    I was rather clear in referencing this topic, and never even came close to claiming the right was immune to playing politics. What I did claim is that they have been largely consistent on the issue of drone strikes, and that it's extremely cynical to play politics with what you view at one point as murder.

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    lol, but in one case we are talking about the US govt blowing up one of it's very own citizens.
    Which obviously 1/2 have of Liberals don't care about and a large number of conservatives don't care about.

    lol. Cognitive dissonance must be a bitch. But no, I always saw the issue as rather complex (open to debate), but always side with caution on issues concerning civil liberties
    Actually I've never been against drone attacks and have never been for drone attacks on US citizens without due process. I don't know how cognitive dissonance applies here. In fact I've posted on quite a few threads on the subject.

    Maybe you should look up what the word means or explain how it applies?
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    Which obviously 1/2 have of Liberals don't care about and a large number of conservatives don't care about.
    again, the encroachment on civil liberties by the Bush administration were defining planks for his opposition. So I highly doubt those numbers would have been similar, prior to Obama taking office


    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    Actually I've never been against drone attacks and have never been for drone attacks on US citizens without due process. I don't know how cognitive dissonance applies here. In fact I've posted on quite a few threads on the subject.

    Maybe you should look up what the word means or explain how it applies?
    bro, you joined in sept of 2011 and we are talking about an ideological shift that occurred during the transition from Bush to Obama, as executive.

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Well, his father certainly was. No evidence has been presented that the son was involved in any plots against the United States. So far, the Obama Administration won't even make an unsubstantiated CLAIM that he was.
    The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    I don't know what is worse...that the Obama Administration seems to believe that it can order the extrajudicial killings of American citizens without any trial (or even any good reason), or that no one seems to care about it. It's hard to imagine an executive power that has more potential for abuse than this...and yet astonishingly, there seems to be a widespread bipartisan consensus that secret "kill lists" are A-OK.

    I find this a bit disturbing. If the 16yo was actually a threat, actually involved with terrorists plotting attacks on Americans, then I'd be fine with it.

    However, so far I have not seen any such assertion... I have not heard any specific reason why he should have been targeted, other than his poor choice of fathers. (/irony)


    Anybody know anything more?

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    Re: How Team Obama Justifies the Killing of a 16-Year-Old American Citizen

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    again, the encroachment on civil liberties by the Bush administration were defining planks for his opposition. So I highly doubt those numbers would have been similar, prior to Obama taking office




    bro, you joined in sept of 2011 and we are talking about an ideological shift that occurred during the transition from Bush to Obama, as executive.
    Bro the planks of the party are generally decided by the most extreme elements. Does the Republican party planks represent all of your views? If you were polled under a President Romney and the views were different than the planks of your party does that mean you shifted ideologically?

    You keep making statements of "I bet if we had poll numbers"...Okay and I bet if a President Gore would of ran up deficits that Bush did right after a surplus the Republican party would be up in arms. I bet if a President Gore passed a Medicare part D that Republicans would be talking about another huge social program and government takeover of medicine. I bet if a President Carter pulled troops out of Lebenon Republicans would be saying he "cut and run" and it showed his weakness. This "what if" game is fun.

    I have no idea what the relevance of my join date is. Bush didn't kill US citizens with drones and I've posted on Obama attacking US citizens.

    I'm also in no way a dove when it comes to foreign policy despite your belief that EVERYBODY! that's a liberal must be anti-war.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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