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The bullies win again[W710; 739]

Henrin said:
And your prove of this is where in the first amendment? Please show how can they pass a law against it when they can't pass a law against it?



Both are fine according to the first amendment and how speech actually works to begin with. Your argument basically says that if I hurt your feelings I'm a bad man and should be thrown in jail. Real free society you got there and really I want no part of it.
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It doesn't make you morally non-culpable, we'll say that.

Look, we've tussled over how you think you should have the right to drive drunk if you want to. If you want to live in an anarchy, move to Somalia where you can do whatever you want. I'll stay here where I'm not blackmailed and where murder is illegal.
 
rocket88 said:
It doesn't make you morally non-culpable, we'll say that.

Look, we've tussled over how you think you should have the right to drive drunk if you want to.
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We did? When did we tussle over the right to drive drunk? I don't remember that.

If you want to live in an anarchy, move to Somalia where you can do whatever you want. I'll stay here where I'm not blackmailed and where murder is illegal.
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Somalia is back.
 
ChrisL said:
I don't want to legislate speech! I just got pissed when I read the awful BLAME GAME that was going on in this thread. The lack of compassion for a teenage girl who felt desperate enough to take her own life is just disgusting and pitiful. Blaming this one or that one is NOT helpful nor does it solve the problem. Is that REALLY what matters here? Who is to blame?
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Placing blame with her (where it belongs) does not show a lack of compassion.
Secondly, assessing blame can be part of the problem solving process, especially when adjudging whether or not there really is a problem that can be/is to be, solved.
 
Excon said:
Placing blame with her (where it belongs) does not show a lack of compassion.
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Yes, it does. By doing so you show a complete lack of empathy for the victim.
 
Wake said:
Yes, it does. By doing so you show a complete lack of empathy for the victim.
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What a ridiculous concept.
She is to blame for taking her own life, so placing blame at her feet (where it belongs) somehow shows a lack of empathy, or compassion.

Clearly it does no such thing.
 
Admittedly, when I first heard about this, I thought she was just thinned skin, which a lot of people are. After reading into it though, I find that this vastly overstepped the lines of bullying and into criminal harassment.
 
Excon said:
What a ridiculous concept.
She is to blame for taking her own life, so placing blame at her feet (where it belongs) somehow shows a lack of empathy, or compassion.

Clearly it does no such thing.
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What is ridiculous is yoj placing all of the blame on her. Why you don't put some of the blame at her tormentor's feet is a good question.
 
Excon said:
What a ridiculous concept.
She is to blame for taking her own life, so placing blame at her feet (where it belongs) somehow shows a lack of empathy, or compassion.

Clearly it does no such thing.
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Sorry, people that go out of their way to torment others with images or words that are purposely hurtful and intended to inflict pain and harm must bear some blame. People do not deserve to be treated in that way and placing all blame at the girl involved in this case lets those who tormented off entirely too lightly. They should feel some responsibility and shame at their actions, sadly they probably dont feel near enough to curb their behavior in the future.
 
Wake said:
What is ridiculous is yoj placing all of the blame on her. Why you don't put some of the blame at her tormentor's feet is a good question.
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Besides "they" not being responsible, or even to blame for her actions (because as we all know, she is the responsible party), am I to assume you have a selective reading reading problem too?


Excon said:
I watched the video.
It was a "Woe is me!" one.
She was wrong for the flashing and the guy was wrong for using it against her in the way he did.

And she got beat-up for her actions. Not that I believe it was a sufficient reason, but it was for her actions.


And she went and laid down in a ditch.
"Teachers ran over but I just went and layed in a ditch and my dad found me."​
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Excon said:
The others, as already stated, are responsible for their actions.
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OpportunityCost said:
Sorry, people that go out of their way to torment others with images or words that are purposely hurtful and intended to inflict pain and harm must bear some blame. People do not deserve to be treated in that way and placing all blame at the girl involved in this case lets those who tormented off entirely too lightly. They should feel some responsibility and shame at their actions, sadly they probably dont feel near enough to curb their behavior in the future.
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Not saying that this is the case here, but people who sit there and take the bullying and don't do anything to minimize it or separate themselves from it are also partly at blame.
 
OpportunityCost said:
Sorry, people that go out of their way to torment others with images or words that are purposely hurtful and intended to inflict pain and harm must bear some blame.
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No one said they should be held responsible for their actions.
Did they?
I believe what is be said this that they are not responsible for her taking her life. She is the sole reason for that decision. No one else.
That isn't going to change.
What needs to change is this blaming of others for someone's actions.


OpportunityCost said:
People do not deserve to be treated in that way and placing all blame at the girl involved in this case lets those who tormented off entirely too lightly.
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Yet she deserves all the blame for taking her life. No one else - unless you wish to indict the parents for bring such an unstable person into existence in the first place.
And this getting off to lightly bs, is just that, BS!


OpportunityCost said:
They should feel some responsibility and shame at their actions, sadly they probably dont feel near enough to curb their behavior in the future.
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Not for her decision of taking her life. She is solely responsible.
 
DashingAmerican said:
Not saying that this is the case here, but people who sit there and take the bullying and don't do anything to minimize it or separate themselves from it are also partly at blame.
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Ah yes, the let's blame others mentality.

That is what needs to stop.
 
rocket88 said:
Yes we did. It was like a year ago, but it happened.
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Ok, I did a quick search and found what you were talking about. I happen to still stand behind what I actually said there and no it does not match up with what you said about it.
 
Excon said:
Ah yes, the let's blame others mentality.

That is what needs to stop.
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I'm not blaming anyone, obviously this is a tragedy and she and her family did everything they could to escape the circumstances, but that is not always the case.
 
DashingAmerican said:
and she and her family did everything they could to escape the circumstances, but that is not always the case.
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That is not apparent from the reports given.
And apparently she just created more circumstances where ever she went.
 
Wake said:
Yes, it does. By doing so you show a complete lack of empathy for the victim.
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I agree.

These people are hopeless.

Makes me wonder if they were/are bullies and are trying to remove responsibility for their actions.
 
OpportunityCost said:
Sorry, people that go out of their way to torment others with images or words that are purposely hurtful and intended to inflict pain and harm must bear some blame. People do not deserve to be treated in that way and placing all blame at the girl involved in this case lets those who tormented off entirely too lightly. They should feel some responsibility and shame at their actions, sadly they probably dont feel near enough to curb their behavior in the future.
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I accept and allow natural selection to work its course
 
ChrisL said:
Why does everyone feel the need to place blame somewhere? IMO, this was an unfortunate tragedy that could have been avoided, but is NOT necessarily anyone in particular's fault! An unfortunate chain of events led to this girl doing what she did. Bad decision-making surely played a role, but laying blame on anyone in this situation IMO is unwarranted.

The girl took her life, not to hurt anyone else but to end her own pain (bad decision). The bullies who picked on her (no matter what cruel things they said), I am sure it was not THEIR goal for her to actually die. Her parents and the school and teachers missing signs or not paying close enough attention, human fallibility.
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The same reason people obsess over news about parents who do something bad to their children. It makes them feel better about themselves. Regardless of how bad a parent they are at least they never glued them to a wall. There are other things at play but that explains the lack of empathy by many.
 
John.NoseTip said:
The same reason people obsess over news about parents who do something bad to their children. It makes them feel better about themselves. Regardless of how bad a parent they are at least they never glued them to a wall. There are other things at play but that explains the lack of empathy by many.
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Maybe you have a point there. I think that some people just lack empathy, or they just don't understand human pain and suffering, but what do I know?
 
ChrisL said:
Why does everyone feel the need to place blame somewhere? IMO, this was an unfortunate tragedy that could have been avoided, but is NOT necessarily anyone in particular's fault! An unfortunate chain of events led to this girl doing what she did. Bad decision-making surely played a role, but laying blame on anyone in this situation IMO is unwarranted.

The girl took her life, not to hurt anyone else but to end her own pain (bad decision). The bullies who picked on her (no matter what cruel things they said), I am sure it was not THEIR goal for her to actually die. Her parents and the school and teachers missing signs or not paying close enough attention, human fallibility.
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Slander, defamation, extortion, blackmail, assault?

All these things happened to this girl.

These are 'unfortunate chains of events' to you?

:rolleyes:

No wonder there is so much bullying going on in the world with ignorant summations and feel good generalities like that.

'Sure, I could feel bad for her. But that's a bit uncomfortable for me. So instead I will just say it's no one's fault, we should do better in the future, blah blah and forget about it'.
 
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DA60 said:
Slander, defamation, extortion, blackmail, assault?

All these things happened to this girl.

These are 'unfortunate chains of events' to you?

:rolleyes:

No wonder there is so much bullying going on in the world with ignorant summations and feel good generalities like that.

'Sure, I could feel bad for her. But that's a bit uncomfortable for me. So instead I will just say it's no one's fault, we should do better in the future, blah blah and forget about it'.
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I really don't care what you think. If you read any of my posts on the matter, you would see that I am completely sympathetic for the child, and I do feel bad that she was bullied, but I will not say that anyone actually really wanted her to kill herself because I know that kids can be very cruel to one another. I refuse to participate in the blame game.
 
ChrisL said:
I really don't care what you think. If you read any of my posts on the matter, you would see that I am completely sympathetic for the child, and I do feel bad that she was bullied, but I will not say that anyone actually really wanted her to kill herself because I know that kids can be very cruel to one another. I refuse to participate in the blame game.
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So the people that instigated extortion, blackmail and assault against this girl should not be blamed, in your opinion?

Noted.


Have a nice day.
 
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John.NoseTip said:
The same reason people obsess over news about parents who do something bad to their children. It makes them feel better about themselves. Regardless of how bad a parent they are at least they never glued them to a wall. There are other things at play but that explains the lack of empathy by many.
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So sorry to interrupt your agreement fest, but what a silly response. That isn't happening here.

The girl is responsible for her actions of taking her life.
No one else.

And you think that speaking the truth as such makes someone feel better about their self?
Absolutely ludicrous!

I think it makes you feel better to say these things about those you disagree with.


ChrisL said:
I think that some people just lack empathy, or they just don't understand human pain and suffering, but what do I know?
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And placing blame (where it belongs, with her), has absolutely nothing to do with such.


DA60 said:
Slander, defamation, extortion, blackmail, assault?
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We have criminal laws against two of those and the others could have been pursued civilly if true.
That is what normal people do. Do they not?


DA60 said:
These are 'unfortunate chains of events' to you?
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Unfortunately yes, as they were brought about in-part by her actions.
She is the one who flashed.
She is the one who knowingly slept with a taken person.
That is not saying she is responsible for the other persons actions.
The harassment should have been pursued criminally, as he is responsible for it.

And no one should be able to lay their hands on another for such a reason. She should have pursued that criminally as well, as the other girl is responsible for it.

But Amanda Todd is responsible for taking her own life. That is a decision she made.


ChrisL said:
I really don't care what you think.
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Of course you do not care what others who disagree with you think.
 
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