Page 23 of 31 FirstFirst ... 132122232425 ... LastLast
Results 221 to 230 of 304

Thread: Assange Speaks to UN

  1. #221
    Global Moderator
    The Truth is out there.
    Kal'Stang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bonners Ferry ID USA
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    32,863
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Assange Speaks to UN

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiggen View Post
    And whenever you say anything that isn't a knee-jerk defense of the Australian rapist, I'll care.
    Not yanking your chain atm.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  2. #222
    global liberation

    ecofarm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Miami
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 07:49 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    66,400

    Re: Assange Speaks to UN

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    So if your child was killed in a war even though he was a civilian that was doing NOTHING wrong you would accept a "general" apology that isn't even directed at you? Some how I doubt it very seriously.
    You think there needs to be a personal apology for all collateral damage resulting from human shields and rogue journalists?

    Nah. Collateral damage is apologized for plenty enough to cover everyone.



    I like open and honest diplomacy. Not hidden.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    When it comes to the government? No. As I said before the only things that should be classified is military movement/stratagies, and military technology.
    Diplomacy requires the ability of ambassadors to pass speculation and other classified info back and forth with their country.

  3. #223
    Sage
    OldWorldOrder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Last Seen
    10-12-15 @ 12:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    5,820

    Re: Assange Speaks to UN

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Do you really think that they would say "Oh! lets cover this up!" No. They would have it fall under one of the various qualifications...such as "interests of National Security".
    That's not a qualification on its own. I have another question: why would you talk about classification requirements if you clearly know nothing about them?


    Ok, now I understand what you meant. I am not calling for the troops that did the shooting to be charged with involuntary manslaughter. My bringing it up was to show that killing someone accidentally is considered wrong in our society. Right? So shouldn't there at the very least be an apology for committing something that was equivilant to involuntary manslaughter (the accidental killing of someone)?
    No. It's a warzone. If they have the time inclination? Cool, go ahead. If they don't? That's cool, too.

    I'm not rationalizing anything that Manning did. As I have said before I agree that what Manning did was wrong. This whole conversation started because someone (can't remember who now without looking) questioned whether "misdeeds" was evidenced in the leaks. I showed that there was.
    That was me. I still don't see any 'misdeeds'. Mistakes made in war aren't 'misdeeds'. I mean, unless we want to just back it absurd: a random ND in the chowhall would be a 'misdeed'. A guy cheating on his wife with some slutty E-4 is a 'misdeed'. If someone is trying to defend Manning, though? No, there's no real 'misdeed'.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

  4. #224
    Global Moderator
    The Truth is out there.
    Kal'Stang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bonners Ferry ID USA
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    32,863
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Assange Speaks to UN

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    You think there needs to be a personal apology for all collateral damage resulting from human shields and rogue journalists?
    There were no rogue journalists or human shields. No matter how many times you repeat it it still will not be true.

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Diplomacy requires the ability for ambassadors to pass speculation and other classified info back and forth with their country.
    No it doesn't. You just think it does.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  5. #225
    global liberation

    ecofarm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Miami
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 07:49 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    66,400

    Re: Assange Speaks to UN

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    There were no rogue journalists or human shields. No matter how many times you repeat it it still will not be true.
    The van was a human shield utilized by rogue journalists.


    No it doesn't. You just think it does.
    The whole world, except you, thinks it does.

  6. #226
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,115

    Re: Assange Speaks to UN

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    When it comes to the government? No. As I said before the only things that should be classified is military movement/stratagies, and military technology.
    Interesting. For example the military keeps all of my personal information on file, to include my social security number, birthdate, etc. Currently, this data is considered classified and it is illegal for someone to pass it out to the public.

    Should that be available to anyone who asks of it? what about videos of my face or identifying information that would allow nutjob jihadists to target my family and home?


    If the United States is spying on another government in order to determine its' movement/strategies and military technology so that we can shape our own movement/strategy and technology accordingly, should that be classified? Or should we ask the Chinese pretty please to describe to us precisely their capability and intentions?


    If another power passes us information with the request that we keep it secret (for example, say, if the Brits have an agent in Moscow), should we abide by those treaty obligations and do so? Or out the agent, possibly get him killed, and degrade national security?


    When you say "military technology", do you mean how the planes fly? Or do you also include how we collect? If information could only have come to us from classified technology, can that information be classified as well, or should we de facto describe our classified technology to everyone via it's capabilities?




    I ask more out of curiosity at this point - you've already admitted you do not understand the classification procedures or the relevant laws and oversight governing them.

  7. #227
    Global Moderator
    The Truth is out there.
    Kal'Stang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bonners Ferry ID USA
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    32,863
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Assange Speaks to UN

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    That's not a qualification on its own. I have another question: why would you talk about classification requirements if you clearly know nothing about them?
    It is a high qualification. One that IS considered. Or did I read it wrong and its not considered at all?

    I know enough to know that the government does it far more than it should.

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    No. It's a warzone. If they have the time inclination? Cool, go ahead. If they don't? That's cool, too.
    Under our supposed morals, yes they should. Otherwise they're being hypocritical.

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    That was me. I still don't see any 'misdeeds'. Mistakes made in war aren't 'misdeeds'. I mean, unless we want to just back it absurd: a random ND in the chowhall would be a 'misdeed'. A guy cheating on his wife with some slutty E-4 is a 'misdeed'. If someone is trying to defend Manning, though? No, there's no real 'misdeed'.
    A "misdeed" is doing something that was wrong. And again, it is not the mistake itself that I am talking about. (for the third time) It is the covering it up instead of at the very least apologizing for it that was wrong. I find it very disturbing that you think that it is perfectly OK to make a mistake that costs lives and not have to, at the very least, apologize for that mistake.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  8. #228
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,115

    Re: Assange Speaks to UN

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    No it doesn't. You just think it does.
    Actually it does. That is, in fact, why we have Ambassadors there in the first place, to present our policies to them, and then to present them to us, with on-the-ground analysis for policy makers here in the states to take advantage of. Analysis which is and must be classified in order to be effective or useful.

  9. #229
    Sage
    OldWorldOrder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Last Seen
    10-12-15 @ 12:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    5,820

    Re: Assange Speaks to UN

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Interesting. For example the military keeps all of my personal information on file, to include my social security number, birthdate, etc. Currently, this data is considered classified and it is illegal for someone to pass it out to the public.
    A small quibble: unless you were/are "closed" (and you'd know if you were) that information is most assuredly U/FOUO. Even if you are "closed", that information is probably still just U/FUOU.

    Otherwise, I agree. If Sri Lanka, for example, knew everything that the US knew about it's military, it'd be pretty easy to shape TTPs for maximum effectiveness. That's just as bad for the US as Sri Lanka knowing about troop movements.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

  10. #230
    Global Moderator
    The Truth is out there.
    Kal'Stang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bonners Ferry ID USA
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    32,863
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Assange Speaks to UN

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Interesting. For example the military keeps all of my personal information on file, to include my social security number, birthdate, etc. Currently, this data is considered classified and it is illegal for someone to pass it out to the public.
    That is your personal information. Thats a far cry from an Apache helicopter killing innocent civilians. It also falls under the catagory of your right to privacy. However I would advocate that your name and rank and your performance record be divulged.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Should that be available to anyone who asks of it? what about videos of my face or identifying information that would allow nutjob jihadists to target my family and home?
    Read above.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    If the United States is spying on another government in order to determine its' movement/strategies and military technology so that we can shape our own movement/strategy and technology accordingly, should that be classified? Or should we ask the Chinese pretty please to describe to us precisely their capability and intentions?
    Spying would fall under the "strategy" part of my exception.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    If another power passes us information with the request that we keep it secret (for example, say, if the Brits have an agent in Moscow), should we abide by those treaty obligations and do so? Or out the agent, possibly get him killed, and degrade national security?
    This would fall under both movement and strategy.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    When you say "military technology", do you mean how the planes fly? Or do you also include how we collect? If information could only have come to us from classified technology, can that information be classified as well, or should we de facto describe our classified technology to everyone via it's capabilities?
    Any and all military technology period. At least until such time as the government deems that it can be declassified.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

Page 23 of 31 FirstFirst ... 132122232425 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •