Page 23 of 26 FirstFirst ... 132122232425 ... LastLast
Results 221 to 230 of 252

Thread: 14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

  1. #221
    Sage
    SmokeAndMirrors's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    RVA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    18,142

    Re: 14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    Again, we have two issues.... a legal issue and a moral issue.

    Legally, we'll see what the courts have to say. I'm not a law... blah blah blah
    If you refuse to read my responses and address the arguments I make, I will not bother repeating myself for you. I have explained -- twice -- the difference between funding religion and being offended, as pertains to constitutional legality. I never said that my opinion is a good enough reason to enforce my views. I was simply pointing out that you're wrong when you say I can't have an opinion because it's not my money, both because it is my money, and because I can have an opinion on whatever I want. My reply is there for everyone to see -- including you, whenever you feel like bothering to read them.
    Last edited by SmokeAndMirrors; 10-08-12 at 10:04 AM.

  2. #222
    On Vacation
    joko104's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    12-03-17 @ 03:32 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    31,568
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: 14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

    Of course there were dragons.

  3. #223
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    The anals of history
    Last Seen
    07-25-15 @ 02:05 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    10,348

    Re: 14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Of course there were dragons.
    What the hell have we been arguing about this whole time then?

  4. #224
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    The anals of history
    Last Seen
    07-25-15 @ 02:05 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    10,348

    Re: 14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    If you refuse to read my responses and address the arguments I make, I will not bother repeating myself for you. I have explained -- twice -- the difference between funding religion and being offended, as pertains to constitutional legality. I never said that my opinion is a good enough reason to enforce my views. I was simply pointing out that you're wrong when you say I can't have an opinion because it's not my money, both because it is my money, and because I can have an opinion on whatever I want. My reply is there for everyone to see -- including you, whenever you feel like bothering to read them.
    Why do you think I didn't read your response? I read quite carefully, actually, because otherwise I would just be debating myself, and that's no fun.

    That said, maybe you didn't read mine? We have two avenues to debate the issue: Legal and Ethical.

    Legally, I don't know how I can be more clear. Neither of us are lawyers, so I'm not interested in having the legal debate. It's foolish to pretend to be an expert in something when you're not, so I won't go down that path with you.

    So.... leaving the constitution out of it...... it doesn't matter WHAT the issue is that is being funded. You're making a distinction between issues that are "funded religion" and issues that are "offensive to religion" when that is irrelevant. What is relevant is that you must apply the same logic to yourself as you apply to others, or be a hypocrite. If you think you have the right to stick your nose in Louisiana's business because some of your tax dollars go there, then you can't gripe when conservatives vote down Planned Parenthood or stem cell research because many conservative's dollars go there.

  5. #225
    Sage
    Somerville's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    On an island. Not that one!
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:10 PM
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    9,774

    Re: 14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    Question: How many of you who have replied to this thread actually have children in the Louisiana school system?


    Most likely one or two of you, at most.


    I question the motives behind this thread. I agree with the poster who said it reeks of a smear piece. Great, everyone tee off and bash the Conservative Christians.


    Here's another question: Are you surprised that Conservative Christianity is deeply entrenched in the traditions of the deep south? Is this some new and breaking development?


    Of course not. It's been that way for centuries.



    Why are you, then, incapable of leaving the good people of Louisiana alone? This is a state issue, it doesn't concern you. Why stick your nose in where it doesn't belong?

    Southerners call it "carpet bagging." You may have good intentions, but I assure you, the good people of Louisiana are more than capable of running their own state without your condescending meddling.

    I have a relative who was a teacher in Louisiana, her in-laws have children in the school system.


    "Conservative Christianity" - by which I assume you mean evangelical or fundamentalist Xianity - is really a late 19th/early 20th C development. It grew originally because the established churches were seen as representing only the elite AND because the established faiths offered little in the way of an emotional connection for a populace, both black and white, that felt the old churches had become too 'rational' and distant from the day to day suffering of the working classes.


    "the good people of Louisiana are more than capable of running their own state without your condescending meddling." Oh - only if it were so. Louisiana has long held a reputation for being one of the most corrupt states in the nation along with having one of the most disfunctional political systems. It also has for many years seen a cultural divide between the hedonism of the Cajuns in the southern part of the state and those "Conservative Christians" found in the northern half of the state.

    Louisiana is another one of those "red states" that receives more from the federal government than it sends to DC with its taxes.

    Louisiana has the highest incarceration rate in the world
    Louisiana is the world's prison capital. The state imprisons more of its people, per head, than any of its U.S. counterparts. First among Americans means first in the world. Louisiana's incarceration rate is nearly five times Iran's, 13 times China's and 20 times Germany's.

    The hidden engine behind the state's well-oiled prison machine is cold, hard cash. A majority of Louisiana inmates are housed in for-profit facilities, which must be supplied with a constant influx of human beings or a $182 million industry will go bankrupt.
    added to that bit about keeping companies from going bankrupt, we also have just a teeny weeny possibility of corruption in the way the system is run
    ... in a uniquely Louisiana twist, most prison entrepreneurs are rural sheriffs, who hold tremendous sway in remote parishes like Madison, Avoyelles, East Carroll and Concordia. A good portion of Louisiana law enforcement is financed with dollars legally skimmed off the top of prison operations.

    If the inmate count dips, sheriffs bleed money.
    So, according to death-penalty advocates and those who promote ever more stringent punishment for crimes, Louisiana should be one of the more crime-free states - right?
    1. Louisiana
    > Violent crimes (excl. murder) per 100,000: 537.8 (8th most)
    > Murders per 100,000: 11.2 (the most)
    > Incarceration rate per 100,000: 867 (the most)
    > Police per 100,000: 542.8 (the most)
    > Basic access: 79.2 (5th lowest)
    > Total cost of violence: $9.82 billion

    Of the five metrics used to generate the Peace Index, Louisiana received the absolute worst score in all but two of them. The state has the eighth-worst violent crime rate and the fourth-worst rate of gun suicides. The state has the highest levels of both police per capita incarceration. The state’s 867 prisoners per 100,000 people is well more than the next-worst state, Mississippi, which has 686 prisoners per 100,000. The state’s murder rate is what truly sets it apart as the least peaceful in the country. Louisiana’s homicide rate in 2010 was 11.2 per 100,000 residents. The next-worst state, Maryland, had 7.4 murders per 100,000 people. Louisiana was also among the worst 10 states for each of the 10 categories shown to have a high level of correlation with violence.

    Read more: America’s Most (and Least) Peaceful States - 24/7 Wall St.

    Now - what with me being a bigoted socialist atheist and all - these data points must be nothing more than liberal lies, but a guy like me does wonder why a state (tied with Alabama) with the highest rate of church attendance in the nation is at the same time rated as the most violent and crime-ridden state in the country. If Louisianians are doing such a great job running their state - why the problems?
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

  6. #226
    Sage
    Somerville's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    On an island. Not that one!
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:10 PM
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    9,774

    Re: 14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

    Peter Grimm asked
    If you had a legal case, where are the lawsuits? Why hasn't the program been shut down? The proof is in the pudding.
    In reply - Don't you read or watch Louisiana news? You have claimed to live in the state.

    Teachers file state lawsuits challenging Gov. Jindal's voucher, tenure laws

    Parish joins lawsuit over school vouchers

    The Concordia Parish School Board joined 33 other school boards and the state's two major teachers unions last week to file the lawsuit.
    Terrebonne School Board joins lawsuit against vouchers
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

  7. #227
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    The anals of history
    Last Seen
    07-25-15 @ 02:05 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    10,348

    Re: 14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

    I live in Chicago, so what can I tell you about Louisiana?

    I can, however, take a controversial but honest stab at it.

    Chicago is a tale of two cities. Northern Chicago has very low crime statistics, while the south side has exceedingly high crime rates. The south side is where the majority of the city's African American population lives, as housing studies show.

    I am not going to guess WHY this is the case. Maybe it is unfair white privilege. Maybe it is the bias in the police department. There could be a lot of causes, and I'm not going to go there. However, the statistics are what they are.

    Louisiana, having the second-highest percentage of African Americans in the United States, is not immune to the problems that unfortunately present themselves to African American communities around the country...whatever the unfortunate cause.


    Quote Originally Posted by Somerville View Post
    I have a relative who was a teacher in Louisiana, her in-laws have children in the school system.


    "Conservative Christianity" - by which I assume you mean evangelical or fundamentalist Xianity - is really a late 19th/early 20th C development. It grew originally because the established churches were seen as representing only the elite AND because the established faiths offered little in the way of an emotional connection for a populace, both black and white, that felt the old churches had become too 'rational' and distant from the day to day suffering of the working classes.


    "the good people of Louisiana are more than capable of running their own state without your condescending meddling." Oh - only if it were so. Louisiana has long held a reputation for being one of the most corrupt states in the nation along with having one of the most disfunctional political systems. It also has for many years seen a cultural divide between the hedonism of the Cajuns in the southern part of the state and those "Conservative Christians" found in the northern half of the state.

    Louisiana is another one of those "red states" that receives more from the federal government than it sends to DC with its taxes.

    Louisiana has the highest incarceration rate in the world


    added to that bit about keeping companies from going bankrupt, we also have just a teeny weeny possibility of corruption in the way the system is run


    So, according to death-penalty advocates and those who promote ever more stringent punishment for crimes, Louisiana should be one of the more crime-free states - right?



    Now - what with me being a bigoted socialist atheist and all - these data points must be nothing more than liberal lies, but a guy like me does wonder why a state (tied with Alabama) with the highest rate of church attendance in the nation is at the same time rated as the most violent and crime-ridden state in the country. If Louisianians are doing such a great job running their state - why the problems?

  8. #228
    Sage
    Somerville's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    On an island. Not that one!
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:10 PM
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    9,774

    Re: 14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

    Peter Grimm wrote
    Do you have proof that federal funds are going to this?
    Louisiana Department of Education website
    Federal funding comprises approximately 15 percent of Louisiana’s K-12 public education budget. For Fiscal Year 2011, Louisiana is receiving nearly $1.4 billion in federal funding.


    How do you separate federal funding from state?
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

  9. #229
    Anti political parties
    FreedomFromAll's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    New Mexico USA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 07:02 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,040

    Re: 14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    I believe slave owners were kind. They had quite an investment in their slaves. They were valuable assets. I think the majority of slave owners probably did not abuse their slaves any more than they would abuse their horses.
    Keeping another human being conscripted to work for like a horse is abusive and cruel in its own right. Im sure those slaves were great once they were broken like a horse right?

    Plenty of people abuse their horses I am guessing that you have not been around many horses. Horses require a lot of work to keep them healthy but most people do not put that kind of effort into their horses. That is why there are so many horse rescues all around the country.


    But the bottom line is that slaves and horses have one thing in common they are captives and the property of someone they do not even belong to themselves. To pretend that slave owners were all nice and kind is revisionism bull****.



    I guess in your book whipping people is a kind treatment?

  10. #230
    Sage
    Somerville's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    On an island. Not that one!
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:10 PM
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    9,774

    Re: 14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

    I guess in your book whipping people is a kind treatment?

    Of course, it's just a bit of necessary training for the unruly - whether it's a horse or some darky who lives with the horses.
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

Page 23 of 26 FirstFirst ... 132122232425 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •