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Thread: Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia

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    Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia

    Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia - CNN.com

    The mother of a pregnant leukemia patient who died after her chemotherapy was delayed over anti- abortion laws is accusing doctors of not putting her daughter's health first. The 16-year-old's plight attracted worldwide attention after she had to wait for chemotherapy because of an abortion ban in the Dominican Republic.
    Doctors were hesitant to give her chemotherapy because such treatment could terminate the pregnancy -- a violation of the Dominican Constitution, which bans abortion. Some 20 days after she was admitted to the hospital, she finally started receiving treatment.
    She died Friday, a hospital official said.

    Thank god we dont do this here in America.

    This is exactly why the core of the abortion debate is Woman's rights VS ZEFs rights. Anybody that denies that just isnt grasping reality.

    This is way I said if you grant person hood at conception it turns the woman in to a second class citizen for 9 months and she loses her rights, freedoms, and liberties.

    Now personally the article doesnt have enough info and theres nothing that says she factually died from not getting treatment but I would NEVER want the government treating women like this and taking their rights away and denying them needed treatments because it might impact the ZEF.

    Abortion isnt a "pretty" reality but its a reality none less and this is why I personally side with womans rights over ZEF rights. One has to be picked, cant have equal rights in this situation.
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    Re: Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective-J View Post
    Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia - CNN.com

    Thank god we dont do this here in America.

    This is exactly why the core of the abortion debate is Woman's rights VS ZEFs rights. Anybody that denies that just isnt grasping reality.

    This is way I said if you grant person hood at conception it turns the woman in to a second class citizen for 9 months and she loses her rights, freedoms, and liberties.

    Now personally the article doesnt have enough info and theres nothing that says she factually died from not getting treatment but I would NEVER want the government treating women like this and taking their rights away and denying them needed treatments because it might impact the ZEF.

    Abortion isnt a "pretty" reality but its a reality none less and this is why I personally side with womans rights over ZEF rights. One has to be picked, cant have equal rights in this situation.
    "'My daughter's life is first. I know that (abortion) is a sin and that it goes against the law ... but my daughter's health is first,' said Rose Hernandez, the woman's mother."

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    Re: Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia

    Quote Originally Posted by RadicalModerate View Post
    "'My daughter's life is first. I know that (abortion) is a sin and that it goes against the law ... but my daughter's health is first,' said Rose Hernandez, the woman's mother."
    Thats the way I would feel I would hold my daughters health and life first every time BUT it would ultimately be up to my daughter if she was 18 or older (this girl is 16), if she CHOSE to risk her own life and that would be her choice, if she CHOSE to save her own life and risk that of the ZEFs than that would be her choice. There would be NOBODY else telling FORCING her choice. Thats for sure.
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    Re: Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia

    For me this situation doesn't go to the core of the argument at all. I am not for abortion on demand but this is a circumstance where I think abortion is permissable. Two lives are at stake and we have to make a common sense decision. This was an unusual circumstance that cannot be used in general to support abortion from the point my point of view.
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    Re: Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia

    Quote Originally Posted by jambalaya View Post
    For me this situation doesn't go to the core of the argument at all. I am not for abortion on demand but this is a circumstance where I think abortion is permissable. Two lives are at stake and we have to make a common sense decision. This was an unusual circumstance that cannot be used in general to support abortion from the point my point of view.
    It goes to the core because it shows factual proof how there can not be equal rights given to the woman AND the ZEF. It has to be one or the other many people fail to comprehend this fact, not saying you, just making a general statement.

    It doesnt have to SUPPORT abortion it just shows that there is no such thing as equal rights in the equation, its a fallacy many try to promote that doesnt exist in reality.

    If one is against abortion, fine, simply admit in most cases you are siding with ZEF rights (which dont exist currently) and thats what you want, do not deny that and claim its equal because there's nothing further from the truth and reality.

    Again to be clear not saying YOU feel this way at all just making a general statement.

    SOME of the prolife people want person-hood granted at conception and abortion to be murder, if that would happen this is what you would get and the woman would be come a 2nd class citizen for 9 months in many circumstances.
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    Re: Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia

    The writeup is emotionally biased. There is no way to know if the treatments started 20 days prior would have saved either lives.
    I'm unsure if this was a 'common sense' decision because IMO all life is worth saving. This decision should be up to the doctors, mom & the family but only because it was life threatening.
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    Re: Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia

    Quote Originally Posted by vauge View Post
    The writeup is emotionally biased. There is no way to know if the treatments started 20 days prior would have saved either lives.
    I'm unsure if this was a 'common sense' decision because IMO all life is worth saving. This decision should be up to the doctors, mom & the family but only because it was life threatening.
    I fully agree with the bolded part 100%
    the underlined part is true if you let be true


    my point is though I would NEVER want a women denied her chemo based on the health of her ZEF. I know thats my opinion but its the one I hold and would never cave on because personally I cant find any rational or logic to do so.
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    Re: Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia

    This is the sort of thing that happens when the government decides when abortion is "permissible" and when it isn't, as well as the sort of problems that happen when laws are based on religion. There is a reason why our founders wanted a separation of church and state, after all.

    Yet, we have quite a few authoritarians in this country who would have the government make the decision for the pregnant woman, rather than leave it up to her and her doctor.

    The astounding thing is how many of those authoritarians consider themselves to be "conservatives" and rail on about the pro choice "liberals". Which one is really standing up for freedom?
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    Re: Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective-J View Post
    my point is though I would NEVER want a women denied her chemo based on the health of her ZEF. I know thats my opinion but its the one I hold and would never cave on because personally I cant find any rational or logic to do so.
    In very rare situations like this, a discussion with the doctors and all the facts need to be on the table before coming to a decision on which life the family wishes to increase the likelihood of survival. To choose either is a decision the government should not be able to make.
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    Re: Pregnant teen dies after abortion ban delays her chemo treatment for leukemia

    Quote Originally Posted by vauge View Post
    In very rare situations like this, a discussion with the doctors and all the facts need to be on the table before coming to a decision on which life the family wishes to increase the likelihood of survival. To choose either is a decision the government should not be able to make.
    I agree whole heartily with the bolded part, but where we probably disagree is while "I" would do what you said, talk to the doctors and family etc before I made a decision I have no problem if the woman makes the decision completely on her own no matter the outcome.

    If the doctor says you need chemo and it will INCREASE you chance of survival form 75% to 95% and she chooses to do so, then I support her in her choice even if "I" personally would have made a different one.

    if the follow-up info was the ZEF has 100% chance of survival currently and with the chemo that drops to 30% I still side with her choice, even if again "I" would make a different one.

    For me the bottom line is its her choice and this is just one of the nasty situations (though statistically rare but where does it stop) that could come up if the government had the right to make these decisions for women and take away their freedoms.
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