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Thread: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy[W:137]

  1. #71
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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Does this mean you can think the sperm away? "No, no, no, don't fertilize my little eggy."

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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by Luna Tick View Post
    Does this mean you can think the sperm away? "No, no, no, don't fertilize my little eggy."
    No, but hormones and chemicals in your body can certainly damage the chances of successful conception or pregnancy. That is the basis on which BC works, after all. Your body is flooded with all kinds of hormones in unusual quantities when you experience extreme stress. While it is certainly not as effective as BC, it does lower the chances of conception or viable pregnancy.

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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    And yet, his statement is accurate. It was probably spoon-fed to him as a generic way of trying to avoid questions about abortion, therefore he only understands it in the context of rape. It applies to more than just rape, but it is none the less true that it applies to rape as well.

    His statement included words like "try" and "rare," both of which imply this mechanism is imperfect (which is true). I have no idea what the hell "legitimate rape" is supposed to mean, but none of that is the point.

    Countering dishonest, slimy people with dishonest, slimy debate tactics does not make you the better person.

    It is completely possible to attack his argument while sticking to the issue. You do not need to get mired in hack politics to do so.

    What I would like to know is why he thinks women who've been raped should be forced through pregnancy. I would like to know why he doesn't believe women are even human enough to have bodily integrity. Everything else is immaterial.

    He claimed females bodies can shut down procreation specifically in response to a "legitimate rape" and that is one hundred percent false.
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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by Furiounova View Post
    Let's look at what he said:

    "If it's a legitimate rape, the female body has ways to try to shut that whole thing down."
    He is saying the female body can react specifically to being raped and will try to shut down procreation.

    You are saying stress of any kind can hinder procreation.

    Those are two very different claims.

    What he said was sick and implied rape victims who get pregnant are partially responsible for that pregnancy because their bodies failed to properly react to a "legitimate rape."

    What do you think he meant by "legitimate rape?"
    but you falsely, surprise...surprise, claimed that he stated women could voluntarily 'shut down" the process. he made no such claim. lying about it detracts from your spurious credibility
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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    but you falsely, surprise...surprise, claimed that he stated women could voluntarily 'shut down" the process. he made no such claim. lying about it detracts from your spurious credibility
    I don't care if he said "voluntarily" or not. If there's sperm and an egg, pregnancy is a possibility. Does this guy need to go back to "abstinence only" sex ed? Apparently he didn't even absorb that information.


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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    And we have a new low for stupidity and classlessness in one post.
    where have you been the last 50 or so years? When it comes to ignorance about all things biological, right wingers have always historically been first to the plate. True, they eventually get it, but only after their much better educated counterparts in liberal communities have figured it out, and in the meantime, there's always much suffering.

    Case in point--the perception of AIDS among people in mostly conservative communities in the 1980s. Even while it became accepted within the scientific community that AIDS is not exclusive to homosexuals nor is it spread by casual contact, the right believed otherwise, and as a result one young man w/AIDS living in a conservative community faced a never-ending barrage of repeated based assaults at his school. . .

    Russiaville faced enormous pressure from many parents and faculty to bar White from the campus after his diagnosis became widely known to protect the other children. 117 parents (from a school of 360 total students) and 50 teachers signed a petition encouraging school leaders to ban White from school. Due to the widespread fear and ignorance of AIDS, the principal and later the school board assented so that the rest of the students would not get sick.

    Ryan White - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    And the reason for that is hardly unknown: right wingers have always had a distaste and mistrust of the scientific community and hence, get their ideas from their pols and Church leaders. . .

    Opposing the Kennedy-Hatch AIDS bill in 1988, Helms stated, "There is not one single case of AIDS in this country that cannot be traced in origin to sodomy".[

    Jesse Helms - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    It's clear that such comments weren't perceived as ignorance at the time given that Helms was re-voted back after having said it.

    Sure, it would be wonderful to believe that the right wing population of MO could just dismiss Akin's comments as just silliness as any educated person would, but history (as cited above) has proven that many of them do not and suck in statements like these into their heads, and then, people suffer (as Ryan White did).

    In this case, of course, young women will suffer, from all those conservative dudes who listened to Akin's comments and absorbed it into their minds, the same way their brethren 30 years ago absorbed comments about gays from Helms, other pols and Church leaders into their heads.

    It's because of this historical fact that the only prudent course of action is to go into every high school in MO, round up all the adolescents with GOP leanings, and shove them into a re-education camp for about 6 months until they realize the underlying truth re: the topic on which Akin spoke.

    Yep, it's a dirty job, but someone's gotta do it. But don't worry--I'm Libertarian, and don't believe the money for these camps should burden taxpayers. I will volunteer to start a charity and raise money for it. At least the lunches at the re-education facilities won't cost much--we'll just sign a deal w/Chick-Fil A for the meals.
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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by Furiounova View Post
    He claimed females bodies can shut down procreation specifically in response to a "legitimate rape" and that is one hundred percent false.
    That is not quite right. He said the female body can "try" to shut down procreation in response to rape, and that conception is thus "rare." That is true.

    It is not a response specifically to rape, and in that sense it would be false. I suspect he doesn't fully understand the mechanism he's talking about (like I said, it was probably fed to him by some advisor). But the statement that conception from rape is less likely because the female body will lower its fertility is correct.

    You're fighting dishonesty with dishonesty.

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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    [QUOTE=rocket88;1060815990]I don't care if he said "voluntarily" or not. If there's sperm and an egg, pregnancy is a possibility. Does this guy need to go back to "abstinence only" sex ed? Apparently he didn't even absorb that information.[/QUOTE

    The argument he should have used is that abortion isn't necessary if one is raped since there's a morning-after pill.
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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    The argument he should have used is that abortion isn't necessary if one is raped since there's a morning-after pill.
    ...Which is still a crappy argument, because EC is imperfect and sometimes fails.

    The reality is, a small percentage of raped women do become pregnant from the rape, despite biological triggers that make it less likely, and despite the use of EC. The question is, for those women, do you or do you not support access to abortion?

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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    Well... he's scientifically correct. It is indeed true that the female body is drastically less likely to conceive from a rape, or while any other severe stressors are going on.

    But how the hell does that answer the question? The question was not "how common is pregnancy resulting from rape?" The question was "would you deny a woman who's been rape access to abortion?"

    I suppose he did, in a round-about way, which was "yes." We should force women to get raped all over again by carrying an unwanted fetus to term so they can reminded of their rape for the rest of their lives. Wonderful.

    What a sick individual.

    Stress might affect ovulation, but where is the evidence that it affect conception? Conception can only take place after ovulation has occurred, so if a women happens to be raped while she's going through ovulation, and the sperm get to the egg, fertilization will occur, and it's still very much a "legitimate rape".
    Quote Originally Posted by Free_Radical View Post

    And I wasn't making an appeal to authority, I was making an appeal to the philosophical body of work of the founders, the worth and content of which should be well-known to anyone with a cursory understanding of basic history and philosophy.

    Brian

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