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Thread: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy[W:137]

  1. #51
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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    More disgraceful mischaracterization. I never said anything about suspicions. I am saying that its far easier to establish a rape took place when there is evidence of violence, threats of harm, weapons etc then when the ONLY material fact in dispute was consent

    Nothing more nothing less

    when you want to honestly discuss what i ACTUALLY SAID let me know
    Ok, so, AGAIN, why do Republicans always seem to make this distinction between "legitimate" rape and fake rape like the GOP senatorial candidate did, but not make it for other types of crime?
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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    It is a stupid argument politically. But I recall back in the good old days when I worked at PP and spent every saturday morning for a couple years arguing with the RIght to Lifers and the Operation Rescue bible thumpers-this issue would come up constantly and I finally talked to a top OB/GYN and She noted that violent rape is far less likely to cause pregnancy than consensual sex. Now that was almost 40 years ago and I have no clue if that is still something she would say-she died about 20 years ago
    Did the doctor also tell you that most rapes are commited by someone the girl or woman knew?

    Forty or sixty years ago, women kept silent about rape and if they got pregnant outside of wedlock no matter the circumstances they were osrtracized by their families and society. Because of that, if the rapist didn't kill them, illegal abortions did. Ahh, the good ol days.
    Last edited by Moot; 08-20-12 at 03:01 AM.

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    [QUOTE=vauge;1058155572]Here are the Rules and Guidelines to help you properly use th

    GOP candidate: “If it’s a legitimate rape, the female body has ways to try to shut that whole thing down,” Akin continued. He did not provide an explanation for what constituted “legitimate rape.”
    Missouri Republican claims ‘legitimate rape’ rarely results in pregnancy – CNN Political Ticker - CNN.com Blogs

    Realizing this is only one person we ought to be restrained from faulty induction to prevent condemning everyone associated with the GOP while at the same time inquiring how someone with this mindset is in the business of elections. That short statement produces an enormous amount of commentary on the horrors of rape and how some still blame women and if they fail to "shut down" the biology of pro creation then it is acceptable to rape the women again by forcing laws between their legs. Is that what he meant by "legitimate rape?" The GOP needs a nuclear enema because it cannot afford even one person still living in the 16th century.
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    Re: Are We In The Year 1582?

    I'm pretty sure in 1582 there was little talk of abortion or the conception process at all.
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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Here is my non-partisan take on this thing. Todd Akin, regardless of how he said it, does not believe in abortions even in the case of rape. I do believe he got caught up in the moment and probably did not convey the message the way he wanted to, however, that message still would have been that he doesn't believe in punishing the fetus in cases of rape.

    I would not support this guy strictly on that basis alone. The rest of it is just spin and people need to stick to the basics IMO.

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    Re: Are We In The Year 1582?

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    I'm pretty sure in 1582 there was little talk of abortion or the conception process at all.
    1487– Malleus Maleficarum (The Hammer of Witches), a witch-hunting manual, is published in Germany. It accuses midwives who perform abortions of committing witchcraft.

    (The 1582 comment was directed more towards his claim women have a way of shutting down pro creation if they are raped)
    My main function as a Christian is to be the biggest possible jerk as a demonstration of the awe found in God's Grace and Forgiveness. (That love part comes in to play at some point)

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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    Well... he's scientifically correct. It is indeed true that the female body is drastically less likely to conceive from a rape, or while any other severe stressors are going on.

    But how the hell does that answer the question? The question was not "how common is pregnancy resulting from rape?" The question was "would you deny a woman who's been rape access to abortion?"

    I suppose he did, in a round-about way, which was "yes." We should force women to get raped all over again by carrying an unwanted fetus to term so they can reminded of their rape for the rest of their lives. Wonderful.

    What a sick individual.

    though obviously stupid. the basic premise that a woman is unlikely to get pregnant from rape is true. it's not like a woman can get pregnant 365 days a year. there is a certain specific "window of opportunity" and unless the rape occurs during this time, she isn't going to get preggers. However, if a woman is raped and get pregnant and she does not want to carry her attacker's child...she should be able to get an abortion no questions asked.
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    Re: Are We In The Year 1582?

    Sometimes the label "regressive" actually fits.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: Missouri Republican claims 'legitimate rape' rarely results in pregnancy

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Ok, so, AGAIN, why do Republicans always seem to make this distinction between "legitimate" rape and fake rape like the GOP senatorial candidate did, but not make it for other types of crime?
    That isn't what he said at all. He was pointing to evidence or lack of evidence which is used in assessing all possible crimes.
    My main function as a Christian is to be the biggest possible jerk as a demonstration of the awe found in God's Grace and Forgiveness. (That love part comes in to play at some point)

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    Re: Are We In The Year 1582?

    Wow. Gotta love stupid people tripping over himself.

    This is definitely a case where the message behind his statement and its ramifications due to the clear intent matters much more than the potential notion of factuality regarding some of what he said. It was a ridiculous dumb thing to say and the type of thing that rightfully will drive votes away from him.

    Also...as someone whose been close to someone on both sides of "date rape" situations (one being accused...one having it happen to them), I can understand Turtle's point that at times there can be a distinction between violent forcible rape that is accompanied with assault and battery and forms such as statutory rape or some forms of what’s thought of as “date rape”.

    Also, I think attempting to attack turtle with a comparison of burglary or (what I imagine you really meant) battery is a bit dishonest. There’s rarely situations where an individual is voluntarily asking another person to physically batter them, so I understand not being perhaps as skeptical in such situations when it’s clearly not self-inflicted because there’s not a strong case that it may’ve been a consensual beating. Similarly with burglary and the notion of just giving your diamond ring or stereo-system away...even more if combined with B&E.

    The entire date rape thing is just a sad and unfortunate situation in our society because no matter which way we go with it we’re going to have people horribly screwed. Be too skeptical of the individual claiming to be raped and you discourage women (and men) who have legitimately had such a situation from coming forward due to the stigma involved mixed with the potential skepticism and ridicule and difficulty in having it conclude in any seemingly justifiable way. Go too far on the other direction however, and you allow individuals making relatively reasonable and understandable decisions, or at least poor decisions that are poor for reasons other than because one thinks they’ll be labeled a rapist, to have their lives completely ruined. Look at the recent freeing of the football play Brian Banks.

    I knew of a difficult with some individuals went to high school with that highlights the difficulty. The guy in this instance made the admittedly poor mistake of doing something in a somewhat public setting, as he and the girl messed around while at his place of work (a gym). This particular time they happened to get caught, and afterwards she claimed he had forced her to do it and she had said no and claimed rape.

    Not you don’t want to be too skeptical because it absolutely could be what she was saying and to be too skeptical is to make a victim feel like a victim all over again, and discourage her from ever speaking out if such a horrible thing happens again. At the same time, based on what he friends had said, she had liked the guy for some time but had avoided going out with him because he was black a few years (She was a sophmore, he a senior) and her father definitely WOULDN’T approve...and the claim of it being “rape” did not materialize until after her father had arrived on scene. So you also almost want to be skeptical, as the guy being an adult is having the potential of his life forever being changed, getting listed as a sex offender and possibly looking at jail time for what may have been a consensual act or at the very least something he had every reasonable notion to believe was such.

    It’s a horrible situation and issue we as a society face without any real good answer to it. So while I understand the desire to jump all over turtle, there’s a part of me that understands….not as means of justifying this idiots comment of “legitimate” rape, but more in a very generalized sense….the notion of there being somewhat of a difference in an individuals mind between truly significantly violent rape (IE with the violence going beyond just the act of the rape itself) and some forms of date rape that occur in terms of how their initial view of a situation may be.

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