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Southern governors secede from Medicaid

AdamT said:
What do you mean by "actual cost of care"? When doctors refuse to take Medicare patients it generally isn't because they would lose money -- it's because they wouldn't be making as much money as they WANT to make. Doctors in the US earn far more than doctors in any other country, e.g. more than double what a doctor in France makes. Of course in nationalized systems doctors also pay far less for school and insurance, but those are things that can be addressed in a comprehensive national health care system.
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I've posted the links in other threads and can't be bothered to go searching for them again, but if you're so inclined you can find detailed information about the cost of care (not Doctor salary..the actual true cost) is well above what government healthcare pays out.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Its only going to hurt their hospitals and other medical care providers. If you are uninsured and show up at a hospital with something like cancer, that hospital will typically have a department whose sole responsibility is to see if you qualify for medicaid, and if so, to get you enrolled. The reason being of course is that they want to be reimbursed for the heath care they provide you. Obamacare, like Romneycare, eliminates the provisions of medicaid that reimbursed providers for uninsured patients. Instead, both programs extended the eligibility for medicaid to include more of the working poor. By refusing to accept the medicaid expansion - that is paid for by the federal government, those states that do so will only hurt their own hospitals.
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How so? Those at 133% of the poverty level are working, if they develop a medical condition that prevents them from working they drop immediately into medicaid qualification anyway, so paying ANY percentage for their medical care prior to that has no positive impact for the state. If you show up in the ER with early stage cancer there is no obligation to treat that as an emergency, that I am aware of, they simply send you away and later diagnose it as late statge/incurable and transfer you to a hospice facility.
 
tessaesque said:
I've posted the links in other threads and can't be bothered to go searching for them again, but if you're so inclined you can find detailed information about the cost of care (not Doctor salary..the actual true cost) is well above what government healthcare pays out.
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Of course ... if you actually believe that it costs a hospital $12 for an aspirin.
 
AdamT said:
What do you mean by "actual cost of care"? When doctors refuse to take Medicare patients it generally isn't because they would lose money -- it's because they wouldn't be making as much money as they WANT to make. Doctors in the US earn far more than doctors in any other country, e.g. more than double what a doctor in France makes. Of course in nationalized systems doctors also pay far less for school and insurance, but those are things that can be addressed in a comprehensive national health care system.
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Pretty much all of that is flat out falsehood. Medicare restricts payments, requires a larger paperwork burden, and pays late. The average US doctor lives on the bubble like we all do. They spend up to what they make, and what they make is not that much.

The doctors making the huge money, the stupid stereotype you seem to have bought into, are the A types who spin off and own several clinics, and specialize in procedures typically not covered by insurance or Medicare.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Its only going to hurt their hospitals and other medical care providers. If you are uninsured and show up at a hospital with something like cancer, that hospital will typically have a department whose sole responsibility is to see if you qualify for medicaid, and if so, to get you enrolled. The reason being of course is that they want to be reimbursed for the heath care they provide you. Obamacare, like Romneycare, eliminates the provisions of medicaid that reimbursed providers for uninsured patients. Instead, both programs extended the eligibility for medicaid to include more of the working poor. By refusing to accept the medicaid expansion - that is paid for by the federal government, those states that do so will only hurt their own hospitals.
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But it will make Obamacare impossible, and that would be great news for every party in the healthcare system.
 
Objective Voice said:
It goes further than that. By not expanding Medicaid, all these Southern states are doing is pushing more poor voters towards Obama regardless of their political lean. If these Republican governors aren't offering an alternative or doing things to improve their state's economy where else are these people to turn to meet their health care needs? Ultimately, all turning down the Medicaid expansion will do is push more people exactly where they don't want them to go - towards the one political party that IS willing to help them meet their health care needs if not now then in the immediate future.

Of course, this feeds right into the "all poor people want are handouts" argument, but notice that I did include the state's role in improving their economy (re: "job creation") to lift the burdon of entitlement expectations. Republicans are only shooting themselves in the foot by not accepting the Medicaid expansion, and they'll only have themselves to blame for it.
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But Obamacare is unpopular. You know that, right?
 
AdamT said:
Of course ... if you actually believe that it costs a hospital $12 for an aspirin.
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If you choose not to do the research it's pretty sad to then make ridiculous claims about it. Just sayin'.
 
The threat of GOP governors to not expand Medicaid is not at all credible. In terms of both policy and politics, their position is untenable. Let's start with the policy: The states are simply getting too good a deal to turn down. The federal government is paying 100% of the cost of the expansion for the first few years, and 90% thereafter. Furthermore, since conservative states like Texas currently have the stingiest Medicaid programs, they'd be getting the most federal money of all the states, to bring them up to compliance with the new expansion. In terms of the politics, all the money is on the side of the Medicaid expansion. Health care providers love it, because it means that they'll actually get paid for treating poor people.

The GOP governors who are truly fanatical in their hatred of Obama might be able to hold out for a few years, but not much longer. This just isn't a deal that their states can afford to turn down. I wouldn't read too much into their threat anyway. It's only been a couple weeks since the SCOTUS ruling, so this is most likely just some butthurt Republicans blowing off steam, rather than a serious act of state policy for which they have weighed all the policy and political ramifications of their decision.
 
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Kandahar said:
The threat of GOP governors to not expand Medicaid is not at all credible. In terms of both policy and politics, their position is untenable. Let's start with the policy: The states are simply getting too good a deal to turn down. The federal government is paying 100% of the cost of the expansion for the first few years, and 90% thereafter. Furthermore, since conservative states like Texas currently have the stingiest Medicaid programs, they'd be getting the most federal money of all the states, to bring them up to compliance with the new expansion. In terms of the politics, all the money is on the side of the Medicaid expansion. Health care providers love it, because it means that they'll actually get paid for treating poor people.

The GOP governors who are truly fanatical in their hatred of Obama might be able to hold out for a few years, but not much longer. This just isn't a deal that their states can afford to turn down. I wouldn't read too much into their threat anyway. It's only been a couple weeks since the SCOTUS ruling, so this is most likely just some butthurt Republicans blowing off steam, rather than a serious act of state policy for which they have weighed all the policy and political ramifications of their decision.
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Everyone understands that this is bait-and-switch. Medicaid is bankrupting my home state of Illinois, and many others as well.
 
wbcoleman said:
Everyone understands that this is bait-and-switch. Medicaid is bankrupting my home state of Illinois, and many others as well.
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Then your state can hardly turn down a huge infusion of federal dollars which will also help to cover their uninsured population, thus strengthening the state economy by insuring that health care providers actually get paid for the services they provide.

Fortunately, I don't envision that being a problem in Illinois.
 
Kandahar said:
Then your state can hardly turn down a huge infusion of federal dollars which will also help to cover their uninsured population, thus strengthening the state economy by insuring that health care providers actually get paid for the services they provide.

Fortunately, I don't envision that being a problem in Illinois.
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You are so right about that. The same group which has bankrupted our beloved Madiganistan will dig deeper, for sure!
 
wbcoleman said:
But Obamacare is unpopular. You know that, right?
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Actually the country is split evenly, with about 10% mad because it doesn't go far enough. But keep swallowing that Fox Kool Aide!
 
Kandahar said:
The threat of GOP governors to not expand Medicaid is not at all credible. In terms of both policy and politics, their position is untenable. Let's start with the policy: The states are simply getting too good a deal to turn down. The federal government is paying 100% of the cost of the expansion for the first few years, and 90% thereafter. Furthermore, since conservative states like Texas currently have the stingiest Medicaid programs, they'd be getting the most federal money of all the states, to bring them up to compliance with the new expansion. In terms of the politics, all the money is on the side of the Medicaid expansion. Health care providers love it, because it means that they'll actually get paid for treating poor people.

The GOP governors who are truly fanatical in their hatred of Obama might be able to hold out for a few years, but not much longer. This just isn't a deal that their states can afford to turn down. I wouldn't read too much into their threat anyway. It's only been a couple weeks since the SCOTUS ruling, so this is most likely just some butthurt Republicans blowing off steam, rather than a serious act of state policy for which they have weighed all the policy and political ramifications of their decision.
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Their hatred of Obama far outweighs any regard they might have for their own citizens. These are the guys who 150 years ago, were signing secession documents.
 
Tigger said:
Assuming they actually go through with it, it should be a great boon for them....

These people will end up getting cared for.... IN OTHER STATES. That means these people will likely be LEAVING Texas, Florida, etc.... on a permanent basis, which I'm sure will also likely reduce those state's burden for OTHER social welfare programs.
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Poor people can't afford to move.


Sent from my homing pigeon using Crapatalk.
 
best thing that can happen to the democratic party
not only will these decisions stall economic progress in their states, forcing it elsewhere ... but it will motivate LOTS of voters to now seek to elect democrat governors who will implement expanded medicaid programs
 
Wiggen said:
Actually the country is split evenly, with about 10% mad because it doesn't go far enough. But keep swallowing that Fox Kool Aide!
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Rasmussen has been polling on this every 1-2 weeks since the scheme was enacted. Their results have been remarkably consistant over time and with other surveys:

Health Care Law
53% Want Health Care Law Repealed
Monday, July 9, 2012

Health Care Law - Rasmussen Reports™

Most voters still aren’t convinced: They want President Obama’s national health care law repealed as they have said consistently since the measure was passed by Congress over two years ago.

The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that 53% of Likely U.S. Voters at least somewhat favor the repeal of the health care law, while 41% are opposed. These findings include 43% who Strongly Favor repeal and 31% who Strongly Oppose it. (To see survey question wording, click here.)

The survey of 1,000 Likely Voters was conducted on July 7-8, 2012 by Rasmussen Reports. The margin of sampling error is +/- 3 percentage points with a 95% level of confidence. Field work for all Rasmussen Reports surveys is conducted by Pulse Opinion Research, LLC.
 
Wiggen said:
Their hatred of Obama far outweighs any regard they might have for their own citizens. These are the guys who 150 years ago, were signing secession documents.
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Of course, it's racism! As always.

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Nebraska governor says state cannot afford Medicaid expansion
Reuters
12:35 p.m. CDT, July 11, 2012

Nebraska governor says state cannot afford Medicaid expansion - chicagotribune.com


(Reuters) - Nebraska Governor Dave Heineman said on Wednesday the state cannot afford the expansion of the Medicaid program under President Obama's healthcare law, but stopped short of saying whether the Midwestern state would join six others rejecting the expansion.

Heineman, a Republican, said in a letter to senators Wednesday that the expansion would force Nebraska to cut funding for education.
 
justabubba said:
best thing that can happen to the democratic party
not only will these decisions stall economic progress in their states, forcing it elsewhere ... but it will motivate LOTS of voters to now seek to elect democrat governors who will implement expanded medicaid programs
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but... but... but... OBAMACARE IS UNPOPULAR!!!
 
wbcoleman said:
Rasmussen has been polling on this every 1-2 weeks since the scheme was enacted. Their results have been remarkably consistant over time and with other surveys:

Health Care Law
53% Want Health Care Law Repealed
Monday, July 9, 2012
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The problem is, right now, this is a bit of reality that the left wants to erase from the discussion. They want everyone to believe that the majority want this new healthcare crap.

Of course, the right ignores polls as well.

But why would any politician ever actually care what the people want or think? They got theirs.
 
justabubba said:
not to those who have no healthcare coverage
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You mean to say that forcing them to buy the health coverage that they can't afford is going to improve their situation? I think making this a federal issue was a dumb idea in the first place, states and municipalities could come up with far better systems for themselves.
 
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