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Thread: Southern governors secede from Medicaid

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    Re: Southern governors secede from Medicaid

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    No Tigger, he just keeps using the ER as many of the uninsured currently do. A lot more keeps folks in a state, family for one, than medicaid. Someone is paying for his healthcare one way or another.
    this. the really poor don't just get in the car and relocate unless they have family somewhere else. the uninsured will keep using the emergency room, and we'll continue to pay for-profit prices for it through our premiums.

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    Re: Southern governors secede from Medicaid

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    I don't see how the benefit outweighs the detriment of maintaining programs that don't work efficiently. Government-funded medical programs (Medicaid/Medicare/SCHIP) all pay out less than the actual cost of service, thereby driving up the prices everybody else is expected to pay. So the capable but un-insured and the insured (via their carrier) pay more.

    And those programs (and the ACA) do NOTHING to address the actually cost of health care.

    So we expand and add more people to government healthcare and then what? See prices continue to rise as costs continue to rise and even more people utilize a system that underpays for service? Makes a **** load of sense...

    I see no reason states should be mandated to take part in any system of entitlement that results in a heavier burden on the rest of the system, especially when their hands are tied to implement policies that would drive down health costs because the fed won't do anything on the national level other than keep pushing for an even more distorted cost-to-payout ratio.
    But the reason why we're continuing with this broken healthcare system is because of constant objection to a single-payer universal system.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

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    Re: Southern governors secede from Medicaid

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    But the reason why we're continuing with this broken healthcare system is because of constant objection to a single-payer universal system.
    Single payer isn't an answer to medical costs either, Sam. People are already strained...higher taxes to cover a program that doesn't pay out at the actual cost of care provided is still a broken system.
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    Re: Southern governors secede from Medicaid

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    Single payer isn't an answer to medical costs either, Sam. People are already strained...higher taxes to cover a program that doesn't pay out at the actual cost of care provided is still a broken system.
    What do you mean by "actual cost of care"? When doctors refuse to take Medicare patients it generally isn't because they would lose money -- it's because they wouldn't be making as much money as they WANT to make. Doctors in the US earn far more than doctors in any other country, e.g. more than double what a doctor in France makes. Of course in nationalized systems doctors also pay far less for school and insurance, but those are things that can be addressed in a comprehensive national health care system.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

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    Re: Southern governors secede from Medicaid

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Its only going to hurt their hospitals and other medical care providers. If you are uninsured and show up at a hospital with something like cancer, that hospital will typically have a department whose sole responsibility is to see if you qualify for medicaid, and if so, to get you enrolled. The reason being of course is that they want to be reimbursed for the heath care they provide you. Obamacare, like Romneycare, eliminates the provisions of medicaid that reimbursed providers for uninsured patients. Instead, both programs extended the eligibility for medicaid to include more of the working poor. By refusing to accept the medicaid expansion - that is paid for by the federal government, those states that do so will only hurt their own hospitals.
    What makes you think they will get treated?
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    Re: Southern governors secede from Medicaid

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    What do you mean by "actual cost of care"? When doctors refuse to take Medicare patients it generally isn't because they would lose money -- it's because they wouldn't be making as much money as they WANT to make. Doctors in the US earn far more than doctors in any other country, e.g. more than double what a doctor in France makes. Of course in nationalized systems doctors also pay far less for school and insurance, but those are things that can be addressed in a comprehensive national health care system.
    I've posted the links in other threads and can't be bothered to go searching for them again, but if you're so inclined you can find detailed information about the cost of care (not Doctor salary..the actual true cost) is well above what government healthcare pays out.
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    Re: Southern governors secede from Medicaid

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Its only going to hurt their hospitals and other medical care providers. If you are uninsured and show up at a hospital with something like cancer, that hospital will typically have a department whose sole responsibility is to see if you qualify for medicaid, and if so, to get you enrolled. The reason being of course is that they want to be reimbursed for the heath care they provide you. Obamacare, like Romneycare, eliminates the provisions of medicaid that reimbursed providers for uninsured patients. Instead, both programs extended the eligibility for medicaid to include more of the working poor. By refusing to accept the medicaid expansion - that is paid for by the federal government, those states that do so will only hurt their own hospitals.
    How so? Those at 133% of the poverty level are working, if they develop a medical condition that prevents them from working they drop immediately into medicaid qualification anyway, so paying ANY percentage for their medical care prior to that has no positive impact for the state. If you show up in the ER with early stage cancer there is no obligation to treat that as an emergency, that I am aware of, they simply send you away and later diagnose it as late statge/incurable and transfer you to a hospice facility.
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    Re: Southern governors secede from Medicaid

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    I've posted the links in other threads and can't be bothered to go searching for them again, but if you're so inclined you can find detailed information about the cost of care (not Doctor salary..the actual true cost) is well above what government healthcare pays out.
    Of course ... if you actually believe that it costs a hospital $12 for an aspirin.
    "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. ... It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

    -- Adam Smith

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    Re: Southern governors secede from Medicaid

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    What do you mean by "actual cost of care"? When doctors refuse to take Medicare patients it generally isn't because they would lose money -- it's because they wouldn't be making as much money as they WANT to make. Doctors in the US earn far more than doctors in any other country, e.g. more than double what a doctor in France makes. Of course in nationalized systems doctors also pay far less for school and insurance, but those are things that can be addressed in a comprehensive national health care system.
    Pretty much all of that is flat out falsehood. Medicare restricts payments, requires a larger paperwork burden, and pays late. The average US doctor lives on the bubble like we all do. They spend up to what they make, and what they make is not that much.

    The doctors making the huge money, the stupid stereotype you seem to have bought into, are the A types who spin off and own several clinics, and specialize in procedures typically not covered by insurance or Medicare.

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    Re: Southern governors secede from Medicaid

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Its only going to hurt their hospitals and other medical care providers. If you are uninsured and show up at a hospital with something like cancer, that hospital will typically have a department whose sole responsibility is to see if you qualify for medicaid, and if so, to get you enrolled. The reason being of course is that they want to be reimbursed for the heath care they provide you. Obamacare, like Romneycare, eliminates the provisions of medicaid that reimbursed providers for uninsured patients. Instead, both programs extended the eligibility for medicaid to include more of the working poor. By refusing to accept the medicaid expansion - that is paid for by the federal government, those states that do so will only hurt their own hospitals.
    But it will make Obamacare impossible, and that would be great news for every party in the healthcare system.
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