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Thread: EPA Spying on Ranchers

  1. #21
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    Re: EPA Spying on Ranchers

    I'm a huge privacy rights advocate, and even I think this is stretching the paranoia a bit too far. I seriously doubt that this is neither illegal nor unconstitutional.

    I did find this amusing, though...
    "The same ends could be accomplished by picking up a phone, sending an email, talking to a producer in person," Kristen Hassebrook, the group's environmental affairs director, told msnbc.com.
    These same people are going to answer openly, cooperatively, and honestly? Really? Phfft! I don't think so.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  2. #22
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    Re: EPA Spying on Ranchers

    [QUOTE=ttwtt78640;1060555944]That is a bit extreme is it not? Do food safety inspections require probable cause warrants in your world too? Routine safety checks (health inspections) are the "price", in loss of freedom, that one must endure to get (and keep) a permit to serve food to the public.
    I assume, yet do not know for sure, that the EPA would overfly ranches only after detection of pollutants in a stream/river to attempt to find the source, not simply to waste time and tax money randomly flying around.[/
    QUOTE]

    Oh no, the government would never ever waste our tax dollars flying around for nothing, LMAO

  3. #23
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    Re: EPA Spying on Ranchers

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    I'm a huge privacy rights advocate, and even I think this is stretching the paranoia a bit too far. I seriously doubt that this is neither illegal nor unconstitutional.
    The 4th amendment is not about privacy.The 4th amendment is about law enforcement needing a warrant in order to conduct a search and seizure. People flying aircraft over you property to look for something is a search.

    The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
    Last edited by jamesrage; 06-05-12 at 11:23 AM.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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    Re: EPA Spying on Ranchers

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy the Kid View Post
    U.S. News - EPA planes spying on ranchers? Lawmakers want answers

    "A Nebraska cattlemen’s group is pushing the Environmental Protection Agency to stop pollution-control flights over ranches, claiming it amounts to spying on citizens. EPA, meanwhile, says the flights are an effective way to quickly spot -- and stop -- pollution from manure lagoons and other waste at large livestock operations."


    Ya just gotta love the gov't. I guess the EPA just wants to make sure all ranchers are walking in lockstep.


    Wonder how they got a warrant to do this? Wonder who's next on the spy-in-the-sky's "lookie see" program? Maybe your backyard?
    Just start shooting them down.

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    Re: EPA Spying on Ranchers

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    Oh no, the government would never ever waste our tax dollars flying around for nothing, LMAO
    We've been flying around Afghan for years, at $400 PrGal, just for the fun of it, so why not ranchers too?

  6. #26
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    Re: EPA Spying on Ranchers

    Why would they fly, when there is no need? There are already satellites passing overhead every few minutes. The EU monitors their farmers' subsidy payments claims by confirming the acreage and nature of the crop by pushing buttons on a computer.
    Don't work out, work in.

    Never eat anything that's served in a bucket.

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    Re: EPA Spying on Ranchers

    Quote Originally Posted by Manc Skipper View Post
    Why would they fly, when there is no need? There are already satellites passing overhead every few minutes. The EU monitors their farmers' subsidy payments claims by confirming the acreage and nature of the crop by pushing buttons on a computer.
    Part of obamas stimulus plan maybe, employ pilots.

  8. #28
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    Re: EPA Spying on Ranchers

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    The 4th amendment is not about privacy.The 4th amendment is about law enforcement needing a warrant in order to conduct a search and seizure. People flying aircraft over you property to look for something is a search.

    The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
    You're extrapolating the limits of the 4th Amendment beyond what they really say, and even mean. The skies belong to the government (read: public), not the individual property owners, and as such they are not violating any private property laws whatsoever. Just as the government also owns the public streets, and can sit there and use devices such as binoculars and cameras to observe as much as they can into private property, they can use the same concept with the public skies.

    There is NOTHING in the 4th Amendment that limits law enforcement from investigating anything they want as long as they do it from a distance. Public areas are a distance. Warrants and the such are only necessary when they want to search the actual property itself.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  9. #29
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    Re: EPA Spying on Ranchers

    Quote Originally Posted by Manc Skipper View Post
    Why would they fly, when there is no need? There are already satellites passing overhead every few minutes. The EU monitors their farmers' subsidy payments claims by confirming the acreage and nature of the crop by pushing buttons on a computer.
    The same thought occurred to me.

    The only thing I can think of really has nothing to do with efficiency, and everything to do with US society's mindset that individual agencies must have power and be independent. For example, since 9-11, many police agencies now have SWAT teams (and/or the associated equipment) that really don't need it.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  10. #30
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    Re: EPA Spying on Ranchers

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    Part of obamas stimulus plan maybe, employ pilots.
    Drones don't have pilots
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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