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Thread: NAACP backs gay marriage

  1. #71
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    Re: NAACP backs gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by MarineTpartier View Post
    I would challenge you to find me an issue that the NAACP contested the President on. Not a person in the NAACP. The NAACP as an organization. This is the exact reason they have made themselves irrelevant. They will support anyone due to the color of their skin even if it disagrees with what the majority of the people they represent believe.
    The Answer Sheet - Civil rights groups skewer Obama education policy (updated)

    You're preaching to the choir about SSM. I am actually someone who used to oppose it but began looking at the individual liberty's involved and changed my stance.
    As far as the 53%. You proved my point for me. That poll shifted 11% the day after President Obama came out in support of SSM. I stated earlier that I believe the POTUS saying that would swing the vote at least 10%. I said earlier that we don't need to look at that as much as the polls showing how much they are against homosexuality as a whole. Proof of that is in one of my earlier posts. As much as 70% (in some polls) do not approve of homosexuality and think it is immoral. The media is cherrypicking stats, polls, and interviews with black leaders who approve of SSM. I still believe that. I could be wrong but I've never seen a group of people shift their opinion of something that fast. I would like to see who they polled and where the polling occured.
    You accept past polls and reject recent polls because the recent polls just don't make sense. That sounds like confirmation bias.

    I know the NAACP is not about gay marriage. It's about representing the black community on issues that pertain to them. Apparently everybody (including the NAACP themselves) thinks SSM pertains to them right now just because the black President came out in support of it. I will say it again. Blacks, as a whole, do not approve of homosexuality. So, the NAACP is not representing their people as they should. I don't know why the NAACP even felt the need to address it, but, they did and here we are.
    The NAACP is about black-specific interests like hate crimes, housing discrimination, etc. If you were to argue that SSM is irrelevant to them, then I can see the validity in that argument. However, your argument that the NAACP isn't representing blacks because it supports SSM is illogical since its representation of blacks doesn't really have anything to do with SSM and since blacks aren't unanimously against SSM.

    I am aware blacks are not monolithic.
    Really? Because, a few sentences ago, you said, "Blacks, as a whole, do not approve of homosexuality" (which is inaccurate, btw). That said, many groups, including blacks, are somewhat monolithic on certain issues. For blacks, gay marriage is not one of them (even with your "70%" stat).

    If you were aware of this you wouldn't use polls showing 53% would you?
    A poll showing 53% of any group doesn't resemble anything monolithic so I don't know how you got from point A to point B.

    If you want to use stats and poll, then the monolithic point needs to be laid to rest now. I don't believe in black, gay, women's, etc rights anyway. I believe in individual liberties and rights, no matter the version of human you are. That's where the monolithic crap comes from. We try to fit everyone into a group, party, or race so we can track them and have stats on them. That's where we go wrong.
    Anyway, your criticism of the NAACP is based two big false premises: that the NAACP cannot represent black interests while supporting SSM and that people can't change their minds quickly.

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    Re: NAACP backs gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    You are dangerously close to calling same sex marriage a racial issue when you make arguments like these.

    Here is a surprising fact...there are gay people who are black. Just something to consider.


    Really? OMG?! I'm so glad to have known that. I've never seen a black homosexual. Heck, I've never even been out of my house...

    The point I was making, that you completely ignored, was that SOME people are going to make it a race issue. Some people are going to say that the NAACP no longer represents the interest of African-Americans. And if you look at the voting trends of African-Americans on Same-Sex Marriage, that case COULD BE MADE.




    From since before the movement was a "movement", through pop-culture today, there have been African-American homosexuals. To suggest that I'm not aware of that? Insulting. To refuse to believe that some people aren't going to make this about race considering the voting margins? Shameful on your part.

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    Re: NAACP backs gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by dabateman View Post
    To refuse to believe that some people aren't going to make this about race considering the voting margins? Shameful on your part.
    I apologize that I don't think like the National Organization for Marriage. It isn't my prerogative to divide people on the issue of marriage. I would rather bring them together for the good of the country and families everywhere.
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    Re: NAACP Backs Same-Sex Marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Invisible View Post
    You seem to be ignoring the fact that people's attitudes can change over time.
    Overtime, yes. Overnight, no.
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    Re: NAACP backs gay marriage

    Lol, I stand corrected. You found one issue in almost 4 years of Presidency that the NAACP stood up to the POTUS about. I will point out though that this was an offspin group of the NAACP and not the NAACP itself. It was also in concert with other groups and they didn't lead on the issue. However, I will concede the point to you.

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    You accept past polls and reject recent polls because the recent polls just don't make sense. That sounds like confirmation bias.
    No, you meant accept past pollS and reject a recent poll (no s as in singular). When one belief has many polls backing it and the other has one backing it, which is to be trusted? I'd say the one with the most data to back it.

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    The NAACP is about black-specific interests like hate crimes, housing discrimination, etc. If you were to argue that SSM is irrelevant to them, then I can see the validity in that argument. However, your argument that the NAACP isn't representing blacks because it supports SSM is illogical since its representation of blacks doesn't really have anything to do with SSM and since blacks aren't unanimously against SSM.
    It isn't representing blacks because the majority of blacks don't believe in what they are saying. Yes, majority. That's what the NAACP should be representing, the majority of blacks. The NAACP represents black people as a group, not as individuals. What else is their role if they don't do that?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Really? Because, a few sentences ago, you said, "Blacks, as a whole, do not approve of homosexuality" (which is inaccurate, btw). That said, many groups, including blacks, are somewhat monolithic on certain issues. For blacks, gay marriage is not one of them (even with your "70%" stat).
    My statement was "homosexuality as a whole". By as a whole, I meant the issue of homosexuality. Not the sub-issues like gay marriage, adoption of children, etc. I didn't mean black people as a whole don't approve of homosexuality.
    70% is a pretty strong stat bro. Again, you have 1 poll backing your claims. I have many.

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    A poll showing 53% of any group doesn't resemble anything monolithic so I don't know how you got from point A to point B.
    mon·o·lith·ic/ˌmänəˈliTHik/Adjective: 1.Formed of a single large block of stone.
    2.(of a building) Very large and characterless.
    Polling black people makes them large and characterless, does it not? If you said a poll of single black people, 18-30, living in New York, then that would not be monolithic. A poll of all black people seems large and characterless to me. No?



    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Anyway, your criticism of the NAACP is based two big false premises: that the NAACP cannot represent black interests while supporting SSM and that people can't change their minds quickly.
    My entire point is that SSM isn't a black interest. Black people have shown through many polls that a majority of them don't approve of homosexuality. Therefore they aren't representing black interests. In addition, I don't believe black people are so shallow that they would change their opinion of gay marriage overnight just because one guy, who happens to be black, said he supports it. Like I said, I'd love to see who they polled to get that 53%.
    Last edited by MarineTpartier; 05-20-12 at 09:18 PM.
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    Re: NAACP backs gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    [/COLOR][/FONT]

    Read more @: NAACP backs gay marriage - POLITICO.com

    Wow... Is this just another campaign tactic of Obama? Maybe yes maybe no, but i certainly fall behind and back this decision the NACCP has made. More popular groups need to step up to the plate and back this message.

    Thoughts?
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    Conservative Star Parker's take on "Sunday" vs "Tuesday" black voters: Blacks and Same Sex Marriage - Star Parker - Townhall Conservative Columnists - Page 2

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    Re: NAACP backs gay marriage

    Perhaps the NAACP should focus more on the lack of marriage within the black community.

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    Re: NAACP Backs Same-Sex Marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by MarineTpartier View Post
    Overtime, yes. Overnight, no.
    Those attitudes didn't change overnight. They changed in the last couple of years. There is a clear trend in all races here in the US that they are becoming much more accepting of same sex marriage legalization.

    Gay Marriage Polls: The Trend Is Clear

    While there is little doubt that Obama likely helped to push that trend a little bit faster for blacks, that doesn't mean that it wasn't heading that way in the first place. It's a generational thing. Our generation and younger are each more accepting than the generations before us, whatever race we are.

    And it comes back to influence as well. When a person someone else admires stands up for something that other person is against, the admirer starts to question why they admire the first person to begin with and why they were against the thing that the first person is for. If the admiration is more important than the issue, it is likely that the admirer could change their stance.
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    Re: NAACP backs gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    Perhaps the NAACP should focus more on the lack of marriage within the black community.
    I think they should focus more on stopping the spread of RB and Rap. Rap sucks, it sounds like diarrhea.
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    Re: NAACP backs gay marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    Perhaps the NAACP should focus more on the lack of marriage within the black community.
    This has nothing to do with it. Black people are allowed to get married, Gays are not....but going with your way of thinking...maybe Heterosexuals should focus more on why so many get divorced, eh?
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