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Thread: Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

  1. #401
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    Re: Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal Fang View Post
    Pointless. In faithful right-wing knee-jerk fashion, you offered up the right-of-contract as some sort of sacred icon or talisman needing only to be waved to have its effect. As any legal novice would have, you then failed to notice any connection at all between that claim and the disgraced Lochner Era that was in quite significant part based upon it. Everything you've posted since then has been the simple gibberish of a failed cover-up.
    More of the idiocy that the poor and middle class are not smart enough to contract properly and the enlightened elite must dictate the terms of the contract for them lest they be taken advantage of. Everything you have posted (I find it hilarious how long it takes you to respond to direct posts towards your psychobabble BTW) demonstrates a sort of welfare socialist noblesse oblige attitude that you are the beneficent savior of those too stupid not to understand the big bad semi capitalist world we live in

    YOur silly generalizations of the rich are either a sickening bit of class envy or some even more disturbing bit of self loathing and self flagellation

    "disagraced Lochner era" means the FDR statist jurisprudence rejected line of cases that was seen as not statist enough

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    Re: Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    You are confusing a private IRA for your own individual retirement with Social Security which is a national program which has both an individual component and a societal component.

    Silly rants!?!?!?!?!? FICA is indeed a tax. That is simple reality. To deny that reality would indeed be the definition of the word SILLY.

    You have been educated on this before. Perhaps you have forgotten?

    FICA & SECA Tax Rates



    Federal Insurance Contributions Act tax - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Federal Insurance Contributions Act (FICA) tax ( /ˈfaɪkə/) is a United States payroll (or employment) tax[1] imposed by the federal government on both employees and employers to fund Social Security and Medicare[2] —federal programs that provide benefits for retirees, the disabled, and children of deceased workers. Social Security benefits include old-age, survivors, and disability insurance (OASDI); Medicare provides hospital insurance benefits for the elderly. The amount that one pays in payroll taxes throughout one's working career is associated indirectly with the social security benefits annuity that one receives as a retiree.
    more of the "the rich have more-we need to loot them more" nonsense. Why don't you read the legislative history"

    I find it interesting you don't deal with the massive tax hikes you want to impose on the people who already pay massive tax amounts

    its time for the rest of the country to start paying their fair share

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    Re: Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    More of the idiocy that the poor and middle class are not smart enough to contract properly and the enlightened elite must dictate the terms of the contract for them lest they be taken advantage of. Everything you have posted (I find it hilarious how long it takes you to respond to direct posts towards your psychobabble BTW) demonstrates a sort of welfare socialist noblesse oblige attitude that you are the beneficent savior of those too stupid not to understand the big bad semi capitalist world we live in

    YOur silly generalizations of the rich are either a sickening bit of class envy or some even more disturbing bit of self loathing and self flagellation
    It is ironic that some on the far right scream, whine and cry when the subject of RACE is introduced into a topic and we hear endless about "playing the race card". But in post after post, in thread after thread, rather than intelligently discuss the merits of national tax policy, the warriors of the right have a whole deck of nothing but ENVY CARDS which they play when all else fails them.
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    Re: Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    more of the "the rich have more-we need to loot them more" nonsense. Why don't you read the legislative history"
    Do feel free to present it from the actual historical record. All we see from you is the usual pompous pontifications that are suppose to substitute for actual historical evidence.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    It is ironic that some on the far right scream, whine and cry when the subject of RACE is introduced into a topic and we hear endless about "playing the race card". But in post after post, in thread after thread, rather than intelligently discuss the merits of national tax policy, the warriors of the right have a whole deck of nothing but ENVY CARDS which they play when all else fails them.
    your constant mantra is that the rich should be taxed more because you pretend that government needs more money and yes you are well known for claiming conservatives are racists

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    Re: Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Do feel free to present it from the actual historical record. All we see from you is the usual pompous pontifications that are suppose to substitute for actual historical evidence.
    Your historical evidence is that the masses want more money from the wealthy and your masters win elections by pandering to that greed

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    Re: Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Do feel free to present it from the actual historical record. All we see from you is the usual pompous pontifications that are suppose to substitute for actual historical evidence.
    you want him to present actual historical records? yeah, ok, good luck with that. lol

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    Re: Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    review the legislative history behind it. The supporters were very careful to not call it a tax...
    LOL! Looks like they missed this part from Title VIII of the act as passed...

    In addition to other taxes, there shall be levied, collected, and paid upon the income of every individual a tax equal to the following percentages of the wages (as defined in section 811) received by him after December 31, 1936, with respect to employment (as defined in section 811) after such date..,

    The name of Title VIII of course is TAXES WITH RESPECT TO EMPLOYMENT.

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    ...nor was it intended to be used for general revenue purposes.
    Payroll taxes aren't and never have been used for general revenue purposes. Of course, since the 1983 revisions, sizable surpluses have been building in the SS Trust Fund so as to serve as a cushion protecting present-day taxpayers as baby-boomer retirement benefits start to come due. To that end, the surpluses have been invested in US Treasury securities. Between the time of issuance and maturity of those securities, the cash does not belong to SS, but to Treasury. SS holds the note. That's the essense of investing, you know.

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Haymarket thinks that every bit of money taken by the government ought to be progressive. HE isn't content to have a highly progressive income tax. There is no reason why people who already pay most of the FIT should have to pay most of the FICA as well
    Math homework: Who pays more FICA -- a guy making $30K per year or a guy making $110K per year?

    Meanwhile, the complaint I hear is that the wealthy simply escape taxation entirely on wage income above the cap. Those most able to pay aren't asked to pay at all on significant portions of their incomes. Kind of weird, wouldn't you say? We did away with the cap on Medicare taxes. We've added the 3.8% Mediacre assessment against capital gains and other investment income. About time we take some similar steps with regard to Social Security, I'm sure you'll agree.
    Last edited by Cardinal Fang; 05-22-12 at 10:02 AM.

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    Re: Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    could you set aside your silly class envy for once and actually deal with reality? The rich already pay 40% of the income tax, all of the estate tax and now the parasites think they should pay most of the FICA tax as well-ask Haymarket, he thinks this FICA should apply to investment as well as earned income as well which would result in huge tax hikes on the people who already pay 40% of the income tax
    The total tax burden on the top 1% is about 30%. The total tax burden on the bottom 20% is only about 16%. The average income of the top 1% is about 100 times the average income of the bottom 20%. In other words, in the top 1% your income is $100, your taxes are $30, and you have $70 left to live on. In the bottom 20%, your income is $1, you pay taxes of 16 cents, and you have 84 cents left to live on. It's the difference between $70 and 84 cents that pisses people off. This has nothing to do with your fabricated and phony "class envy". It has to do with defense by some of the indefensible.
    Last edited by Cardinal Fang; 05-22-12 at 10:10 AM.

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    Re: Über Rich Renouncing U.S Citizenship as IRS Cracks Down on Tax Evaders [W:209]

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Your historical evidence is that the masses want more money from the wealthy and your masters win elections by pandering to that greed
    You utterly have FAILED to present anything other than your own opinion that FICA is not a tax.

    Perhaps you are familiar with Supreme Court rulings on the subject?

    Helvering v. Davis, 301 U.S. 619 (1937), decided on the same day as Steward, upheld the program because "The proceeds of both [employee and employer] taxes are to be paid into the Treasury like internal-revenue taxes generally, and are not earmarked in any way". That is, the Social Security Tax was constitutional as a mere exercise of Congress's general taxation powers
    Now explain to us again how FICA is not a tax?
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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