That is quite the tangent, and if you really want to go down that dark hole, I'll push you. Her ID as a CIA agent came from the VP's office, that was established long ago. What that has to do with UBL courier, I have no idea.I'm certain you were probably screaming to high heaven when Valerie Plame was "outed".
Does it matter anymore?
1) The CIA confirmed using waterboarding on three Al-Qaeda suspects, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, Abu Zubaydah, and Abd al-Rahim al-Nashiri, in 2002 and 2003.
2) During the presidency of George W. Bush, U.S. government officials at various times said they did not believe waterboarding to be a form of torture, despite hanging the Japanese for waterboarding captured U.S. troop during World War II.
3) In January 2009 President Barack Obama banned the use of waterboarding, though tens of thousands of troops are waterboarded as part of SERE training.
4) In August 2009 the Justice Department announced that those who exceeded approved "techniques" might in fact face prosecution, though none were.
In the mean time, Democrats labeled GITMO as a modern Gulag (though only while a Republican was in the White House) and one even mentioned a comparison of Bush to Hitler. Republicans refused to see reason, because they felt as if doing so meant they no longer supported the "War on Terror." So what we had here was an entire argument over the years, held out in the open for all the world to be entertained. Victims of the the true Russian Gulags or Hitler's torture and murder machine had their experiences slighted and diminished just so people in Washington could either be a true Democrat or a true Republican. So politicians and their dimwitted constituents on both sides could drag America around the mud for the world's entertainment, three waterboarded terrorists were exaggerated into a mass systematic machine of henious torture at American hands. How many actually depraved governments and populations around the world were alleviated of responsibility because Americans chose to exaggerate the situation?
Oh, and let's not forget about that insignificant troop in the field that was sent forward to murder on behalf of Americans everywhere that wanted their 9/11 revenge only to flip television channels and criticize his every effort. A recent United Kingdom high court ruling on the use of hooding prisoners as a detention or interrogation technique indicated that use of any form of sensory obstruction, such as use of blindfolds, goggles or earmuffs, in place of hooding, which is outlawed, could only be temporary and "only for the time and extent necessary to preserve operational security." British military and security officers were directed not to work with governments that do not observe these rules. So our closest ally in the world has been ordered to not support our troops beause we blindfold our prisoners to keep them disoriented and without the ability to plan harm upon captors. Today, even hoodnig our prisoners is a form of "torture." All of this stems from the American quest to wreck America's image in the media by exaggerating the issue for politicial points. And constituents are as guilty as those with microphones.
All for the sake of three. We are a stupid people anymore. We can drop nuclear bombs on civilian cities...but no one will have water tossed on their heads. The manner in which we "make a stand" is pathetic.
Last edited by MSgt; 05-05-12 at 12:26 PM.
The CIA has a very vested interest in making the case for torture. They are not out of the war crimes woods just yet. Any and all straws must be grasped in this attempt to justify torture. The ends justify the means argument. Given past CIA lies I wouldn't nominate any of them for Sainthood and believe every word as if Gawd Himself uttered them.
Problem with torture intel is it takes a while to verify, which screaming confession is the real confession? Such intel is extremely time sensitive. It is quite possible in hindsight the dots can be connected back through the now confirmed facts that some of the torture confessions were in fact true.
But that is reverse engineering a cover story, not what lead us to the compound.
But the argument FOR torture is flawed from the beginning. Many experts say the intel could easily have been gathered without torture and with far fewer versions to verify. As it stands there is no way to know if the FBI's methods would have been faster and more accurate.
Say, when someone deliberately targets civilians with an explosive device to compel some sort of action on part of their government, what do they call it these days?
Last edited by Deuce; 05-06-12 at 07:59 PM.
One of you will end up here next!
Torture is illegal. Torture doesn't work effectively. GWShiiteForBrains promoted and defended torture. Conservatives must now swallow the turd. The instigator of the GWShiiteForBrains Great Depression may have had and still does have a few screws loose. He did not get OLB "dead or alive," he tortured, he lied, he mismanaged, and now we have sham trial atmosphere in Guantanamo and must pretend "torture" did not happen by making that public information "secret,' so that it may not be admitted as evidence and tainting the prosecutions evidence as "fruit of a tainted tree." That is why they are not being tried in a civilian court. The evidence on these scumbags would have to be thrown out because we had scumbag leadership doing scumbag things to prisoners. The chickens are coming home to roost. Are y'all gonna feel great pride in these Guantanamo military proceedings or great shame. I will feel great shame. It's hard to believe our Nation has been brought to such evil impasse. It's state "secret" that they were tortured, by the way.
Fruit of a tainted tree?!