Anti-Bullying Speaker Curses Christian Teens[W:165; 667]

Flippinfunky said:

Homosexuals arent the ones trying to ban heterosexual marriage ...perhaps if someone were trying to deny you equal rights, you'd be a little snippy too. Bottom line is, two people, whom you dont even know, getting married is NOT going to cause your car to break down, your dog to fart, your hot water heater to leak or your marriage to fail.

When the love is gone from a marriage it boils down to nothing more than a legal binding contract between two people...so what is it you want to deny them? The right to enter into a contract? You cant deny them their love for each other...they'll still live together, sleep together, eat together and go vacation together...all the same things heterosexual married couples do... so why not give them the freedom to bind to each other by contract? How's it going to personally hurt YOU?

Click to expand...

Well im trying to keep it banned because im a bigot and homophobe and a very hateful person...and I dont allow anyone to bogart me...alot of people dont like when you dont let them bogart you...

lpast said:

Well im trying to keep it banned because im a bigot and homophobe and a very hateful person...and I dont allow anyone to bogart me...alot of people dont like when you dont let them bogart you...

Click to expand...

would you like to rub our balls together... perhaps... you will be more open to other peoples and political cultures...

lpast said:

Well im trying to keep it banned because im a bigot and homophobe and a very hateful person...and I dont allow anyone to bogart me...alot of people dont like when you dont let them bogart you...

Click to expand...

Well, I'm sorry for you...who raised you to be a "very hateful person, bigot homophobe"?

Flippinfunky said:

Well, I'm sorry for you...who raised you to be a "very hateful person, bigot homophobe"?

Click to expand...

The priests and nuns in the convent I was raised in...thanks for the concern

MKULTRABOY said:

would you like to rub our balls together... perhaps... you will be more open to other peoples and political cultures...

Click to expand...

Thanks for asking but I only have a passion for the real thing...GOILS...lol...

lpast said:

Well im trying to keep it banned because im a bigot and homophobe and a very hateful person...and I dont allow anyone to bogart me...alot of people dont like when you dont let them bogart you...

Click to expand...

lpast said:

The priests and nuns in the convent I was raised in...thanks for the concern

Click to expand...

Well that's sad...They certainly didnt do a good job of representing Jesus, eh?

DiAnna said:

Josie, when Christians call homosexuality a sin specifically because the Bible says it is a sin... and it turns out that the Bible doesn't say that at all (In the NT, which according to you and many others is the only Bible Christians accept), then moving the goalposts to another topic, like child molestation, is a strawman.

The bottom line is that when Christians call homosexuality a sin because their Bible says it is, they are misstating the contents of their own Bible. Doesn't mean they have to "like" homosexual behavior; doesn't mean they have to agree with it. They just cannot legitimately state that it's a recognized sin in the Bible. It isn't.

Click to expand...

The bible doesn't say it's a sin. The Bible says that homosexual acts are forbidden.

ThePlayDrive said:

Savage didn't say anything about evil intent or hatred or vicious, from what I saw. He just pointed out irrationality and stupidity.


I agree. Gay people can only take so much bigotry and intolerance and actual restriction on their behavior before quoting some Bible quotes and calling them bull****.

Click to expand...

So what Savage may have experienced forced him off-topic and into an offensive riff? He couldn't take it anymore?

What I remain curious about is whether Savage ever got around to talking about using alternative social media to effect change. I looked a couple of days ago unsuccessfully--has the entire speech been made available yet?

Josie said:

You're getting at something here. Hating the sin is what scripture teaches. Confusing the act with the person isn't the fault of Christianity, but the fault of the person that's confused.

Click to expand...

Exactly. We all are sinners; we each fall short every day, and the directive is "Judge not...."

I don't remember who (mac?), but someone earlier on this thread said that he has never heard condemnation of homosexuality from the pulpit. I haven't either, not even once in my life.

Some seem to think that being Christian and being gay are mutually exclusive, and this just isn't so anymore than it's true that being a Christian equals intolerance. Meanwhile, in 100 pages, has anybody presented evidence that the bullying of gay teenagers is being done because of Christianity?

Or is bullying more likely the result of other teens' own insecurities?

Gay Bullying Statistics - Bullying Statistics

Here's an interview with the Exec Director of the Trevor Project that includes stats. He says:
]
What I would also very much like Christians to know is that being gay isn't a choice that anyone makes. It's not a switch you can turn off and on. Gay people were born into creation just like anyone else, and to devalue who they are by insisting God didn't really make them as they are is to deny them the right to a rich and loving relationship with God, and that's a terrible, terrible thing to deny anybody. No one should ever use scripture to justify removing another person from the spiritual process. If you're a Christian, as I am, you should look to Christ for how to live and act toward others. And what does the Great Commandment of Jesus say but that we're all supposed to love our neighbors as we love ourselves? I wish more Christians would remember what Jesus himself told them to do.

John Shore: Gay Teen Suicides, Bullying and Christianity: A Talk with the Trevor Project Director

Somerville said:

It all depends upon the manner in which many who call themselves 'Christian' interpret what they read. The argument as noted in the Westar linked piece is over interpretation of the original Greek text. So today many people are arguing over interpretations of interpretations of interpretations.

The Westar essay does not say "there is no mention of homosexuality in the New Testament", the phrase used was "what we have learned to call ‘sexual orientation’.”

Josie, which version of the Bible have you read during your life, or have you read more than one version? Have you read the New Testament in the ancient Greek version?

Click to expand...

Well everything is based on how a reader interprets what they've read.


Since I'm not a great "religion" scholar, exactly which "religion" are you talking about? Now don't just say "evanglists". I'd like to be able to research the exact religion/church that is doing this. Thanks.

Billy the Kid said:

Well everything is based on how a reader interprets what they've read.


Since I'm not a great "religion" scholar, exactly which "religion" are you talking about? Now don't just say "evanglists". I'd like to be able to research the exact religion/church that is doing this. Thanks.

Click to expand...

Another one obsessed with religion being the causes of all woes...Im against gay marriage and not for a single religious reason...neither is all the others I know that are against it....stop blaming christians for the whole thing

nota bene said:

So what Savage may have experienced forced him off-topic and into an offensive riff? He couldn't take it anymore?

What I remain curious about is whether Savage ever got around to talking about using alternative social media to effect change. I looked a couple of days ago unsuccessfully--has the entire speech been made available yet?

Click to expand...

It's odd that you direct your comments towards me when lpast was the one who initially mentioned that it's understandable/fine for people to lose it when they can't take it anymore. Why is that?

ThePlayDrive said:

It's odd that you direct your comments towards me when lpast was the one who initially mentioned that it's understandable/fine for people to lose it when they can't take it anymore. Why is that?

Click to expand...

True very true...and let me add please...when people have finally reached their limit on how much abuse and name calling they will accept while TRYING TO BE CIVIL and just honest...then they become dogs and relentlessly tenacious in returning fire.....you can call it...if you keep asking for it...eventually someone is going to give it to you...and you need to be prepared to take what you have given....its a simple part of life.

lpast said:

True very true...and let me add please...when people have finally reached their limit on how much abuse and name calling they will accept while TRYING TO BE CIVIL and just honest...then they become dogs and relentlessly tenacious in returning fire.....you can call it...if you keep asking for it...eventually someone is going to give it to you...and you need to be prepared to take what you have given....its a simple part of life.

Click to expand...

It's odd that you have this philosophy and yet you have so much condemnation for gay people who've had enough bigotry and arbitrary denial of equality.

ThePlayDrive said:

It's odd that you have this philosophy and yet you have so much condemnation for gay people who've had enough bigotry and arbitrary denial of equality.

Click to expand...

I dont know why you find it odd or the least bit confusing...Its not like im trying to disguise anything...I hate ALL gays and im as bigotted and homophobic as it comes...If I had a choice I would give you all your own country....now theres some hate for ya buddy....you thrive on wanting to believe everyone hates you...that doesnt agree that YOU SHOULD HAVE YOUR EVERY LITTLE DESIRE.....life is hard then we all die

lpast said:

I dont know why you find it odd or the least bit confusing...Its not like im trying to disguise anything...I hate ALL gays and im as bigotted and homophobic as it comes...If I had a choice I would give you all your own country....now theres some hate for ya buddy....you thrive on wanting to believe everyone hates you...that doesnt agree that YOU SHOULD HAVE YOUR EVERY LITTLE DESIRE.....life is hard then we all die

Click to expand...

The fact that I'm not gay is the least of the problems with this post.

mac said:

The bible doesn't say it's a sin. The Bible says that homosexual acts are forbidden.

Click to expand...

No. It's doesn't. The bible doesn't 'say' anything. Characters in the stories speak about their customs and beliefs.

The bible is a collection of books, letters, early writings and FICTION. It's not a single book. It's a library assembled by the early Catholic church. Those MEN chose what to include based on their own prejudices, fears, and what they wanted the church to be. Most of the bible is allegory and historical narrative.

We can understand a lot about early western civilization by studying these various writings, but to use them to create modern public policy would be backwards. Like using Beowulf to train modern soldiers.

lpast said:

I dont know why you find it odd or the least bit confusing...Its not like im trying to disguise anything...I hate ALL gays and im as bigotted and homophobic as it comes...If I had a choice I would give you all your own country....now theres some hate for ya buddy....you thrive on wanting to believe everyone hates you...that doesnt agree that YOU SHOULD HAVE YOUR EVERY LITTLE DESIRE.....life is hard then we all die

Click to expand...

you should let me visit you... you'll hate gays less afterwards...

hazlnut said:

No. It's doesn't. The bible doesn't 'say' anything. Characters in the stories speak about their customs and beliefs.

The bible is a collection of books, letters, early writings and FICTION. It's not a single book. It's a library assembled by the early Catholic church. Those MEN chose what to include based on their own prejudices, fears, and what they wanted the church to be. Most of the bible is allegory and historical narrative.

We can understand a lot about early western civilization by studying these various writings, but to use them to create modern public policy would be backwards. Like using Beowulf to train modern soldiers.

Click to expand...

Yeah, that's all well and good. In the books of the bible it is written that homesxual acts are forbidden. Specifically in Leviticus, a book contained in the Bible. Whether or not it's fiction is simply your opinion.

lpast said:

Another one obsessed with religion being the causes of all woes...Im against gay marriage and not for a single religious reason...neither is all the others I know that are against it....stop blaming christians for the whole thing

Click to expand...

You need to read my back posts, friend, and you'll see I've posted over and over that Savage was a bully.

mac said:

Yeah, that's all well and good. In the books of the bible it is written that homesxual acts are forbidden. Specifically in Leviticus, a book contained in the Bible. Whether or not it's fiction is simply your opinion.

Click to expand...

But the bible was edited by the catholic church... are you sure you want to read it?

mac said:

The bible doesn't say it's a sin. The Bible says that homosexual acts are forbidden.

Click to expand...

How is it not a sin in your opinion? I think if something is forbidden, or an abomination, that might qualify as sin.

Josie, this is an excerpt from a select article on why homosexuality tends to be focused on more than other sins.

The purpose of this paper is not to single out or come down upon homosexuals. I have never written a paper entitled: "Is Stealing a Sin for New Testament Believers?" or, "Is Bearing False Witness a Sin?" or, "Is Murder a Sin?" So why "homosexuality? Because more and more, the media, entertainment, the government, the Church, the general population of America and much of the world, no longer believes it is a sin to be discriminated against, whereas even the basest of nations have laws against stealing, false witness, and murder.

Click to expand...

IS HOMOSEXUALITY A SIN FOR NEW TESTAMENT BELIEVERS

lpast said:

I dont know why you find it odd or the least bit confusing...Its not like im trying to disguise anything...I hate ALL gays and im as bigotted and homophobic as it comes...If I had a choice I would give you all your own country....now theres some hate for ya buddy....you thrive on wanting to believe everyone hates you...that doesnt agree that YOU SHOULD HAVE YOUR EVERY LITTLE DESIRE.....life is hard then we all die

Click to expand...

I am curious. Why do you have so much hatred for homosexuals?

L. Ray Smith, author of IS HOMOSEXUALITY A SIN FOR NEW TESTAMENT BELIEVERS is considered a bit of a heretic by others who name themselves 'Christian'

L. Ray Smith = 'Hell' Ray Smith, the blaspheming legalist who must repent!

Like many who adopt the universalist stance, L. Ray Smith has an objection to "hell", Not just the concept, but the word itself.

L. Ray Smith
This guy is a real case. Smith is a total heretic who like all or most cultists, denies eternal punishment in hell, the triune nature of God, and is a universalist.

Click to expand...

My point is one that I noted earlier in the debate - the "No True Scotsman" argument. When an opponent points at an individual or a group on the other side of the question and notes that they do X, an action or words found offensive by many, and justify doing X by quoting the Bible, far too often we receive the answer "Well they aren't real Christians, you know". No I don't know, the definition of those who are called Christian has just a few variants, to say the least.


A major problem for those who cite the Bible to justify their actions is the incredibly wide range of behaviour that is praised in the book while an equally great number of actions are condemned in the same text. As the book was written by and for the people of a culture that was very different from ours today, I personally see very little that may be considered relevant for our society. Very little that is relevant which is not also found in the holy texts of many other faiths, nothing that argues for the moral superiority of those religions based on the bible over other religions.

and please don't bother with quoting bloodthirsty passages from the Quran, there are as many if not more to be found in the Bible.