• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Anti-Bullying Speaker Curses Christian Teens[W:165; 667]

The point is the rationale used by bullies for the continuation of the bullying, ie the Biblical justification.....the topic at hand. Now don't go off and say there are many other justifications used....Savage is not denying that, the focus of his and the topic at hand is the Biblical justification.

The Bible doesn't encourage the bullying of homosexuals. It teaches the immorality of it. Does the Bible encourage the bullying of adulterers? Of course not. It doesn't encourage or condone the bullying of anyone. It teaches morality. Other than the Westboro Baptist Church which has about 70 members who are these Christians that are using the Bible to bully gays?
 
For one thing, YourStar deserves All of the credit For changing her viewpoint after reconsidering certain thoughts just as some of us do when someone makes a fair point. She has much in personal stake, more so than the ones who criticized her (us included).

I'm impressed that so many liberals are not even aware of their own intellectual history. The Bible had long influenced conservative and liberal impulses as well as movements. It happened with slavery and it is happening with regard to homosexuality. The Bible to many of the important liberals in history was NOT a proslavery book, but rather an indictment upon slavery itself. It also became a staple of life for the African American community, both free and enslaved.
 
I'm impressed that so many liberals are not even aware of their own intellectual history. The Bible had long influenced conservative and liberal impulses as well as movements. It happened with slavery and it is happening with regard to homosexuality. The Bible to many of the important liberals in history was NOT a proslavery book, but rather an indictment upon slavery itself. It also became a staple of life for the African American community, both free and enslaved.

Given the prominence of ministers in the abolition movement and then the civil rights movement, you would have thought that would have been something that leapt out...

:D But I'll admit, I've always enjoyed the rather delicious irony. Slavers introduced the Bible to their slaves to try to teach them obedience, and apparently forgot that they would also learn all about that "Moses" guy.
 
I'm fashionably late as always. :)

I would have walked out too, and I'm not a christian. It was advertised as a social-media, anti-bullying speech, not a bible-bashing tirade. I would have been out of there within seconds of the first religious insult hurled. Just because I don't believe the tenants of a particular religion does not mean I don't believe in respecting those who do believe.

The guy is an asshole who set the anti-bullying movement back a decade.
 
The Bible doesn't encourage the bullying of homosexuals. It teaches the immorality of it. Does the Bible encourage the bullying of adulterers? Of course not. It doesn't encourage or condone the bullying of anyone. It teaches morality. Other than the Westboro Baptist Church which has about 70 members who are these Christians that are using the Bible to bully gays?
The Bible does say that the adulterer should be stoned, and Jesus is conflicted when he says to follow the old testament. Homosexuality is condemned, we are told those who practice it will go to hell, you don't associate with those condemned...hence families renounce their members who do come out, kick them out. Peers do use Leviticus as justification for their bullying. It is documented, to deny it is to deny reality.
 
Last edited:
Have you all forgotten American history?

The number one reason people came to America and settled in the first place, was to escape religious persecution. What took place in that High School was state sponsored religious hate speech. It was no more acceptable than it would have been for someone to give a speech attacking homosexuals and their lifestyle.

What's really sad about this, is 90% of those on the left who don't take issue with this, would have raised hell if that guy would have attacked Islam instead of Christianity.
 
For one thing, YourStar deserves All of the credit For changing her viewpoint after reconsidering certain thoughts just as some of us do when someone makes a fair point. She has much in personal stake, more so than the ones who criticized her (us included).

I'm impressed that so many liberals are not even aware of their own intellectual history. The Bible had long influenced conservative and liberal impulses as well as movements. It happened with slavery and it is happening with regard to homosexuality. The Bible to many of the important liberals in history was NOT a proslavery book, but rather an indictment upon slavery itself. It also became a staple of life for the African American community, both free and enslaved.
Abolitionists used the Bible to justify their positions, just as the Southerners used it to justify theirs. The interpretations and rejections of portions of the Bible are acknowledged MORE so by liberals, we see how it can be used for good and evil.
 
Given the prominence of ministers in the abolition movement and then the civil rights movement, you would have thought that would have been something that leapt out...

:D But I'll admit, I've always enjoyed the rather delicious irony. Slavers introduced the Bible to their slaves to try to teach them obedience, and apparently forgot that they would also learn all about that "Moses" guy.

Well as I said before you had a couple I different reactions to this. On one hand, many slaves were prevented from receiving "the Word" altogether, from this realization of the many undermining points of slavery and racism commonly accepted by society. Other slaves were taught the full scripture, not realizing how undermining it was. Others were taught Christianity, but whereas the slave owning families were taught a normal service, the minister would visit the slaves later and preach the obedience of the master. This also did not stop slaves from holding their own services in private, hidden from view.

Then as you and I have said, the abolitionist movement was heavily influenced by Christian beliefs-holding that it was the Bible that held truth about equality and the evil of slavery, unlike the US constitution (though this later changed with Douglass who thought both undermined slavery).

Again, the speaker repeated that the Bible "got slavery wrong." He simply could not open his eyes as to how incorrect he was. People didn't simply ignore parts of the text, they PROMOTED its words as justice and salvation.
 
Have you all forgotten American history?

The number one reason people came to America and settled in the first place, was to escape religious persecution. What took place in that High School was state sponsored religious hate speech. It was no more acceptable than it would have been for someone to give a speech attacking homosexuals and their lifestyle.

What's really sad about this, is 90% of those on the left who don't take issue with this, would have raised hell if that guy would have attacked Islam instead of Christianity.
Isn't that IRONIC!?!.....religious groups came to the US to escape persecution.....but then their followers end up using religion as a justification to persecute another group.

But then again, it isn't the first...or the last....time.
 
Well as I said before you had a couple I different reactions to this. On one hand, many slaves were prevented from receiving "the Word" altogether, from this realization of the many undermining points of slavery and racism commonly accepted by society. Other slaves were taught the full scripture, not realizing how undermining it was. Others were taught Christianity, but whereas the slave owning families were taught a normal service, the minister would visit the slaves later and preach the obedience of the master. This also did not stop slaves from holding their own services in private, hidden from view.

Then as you and I have said, the abolitionist movement was heavily influenced by Christian beliefs-holding that it was the Bible that held truth about equality and the evil of slavery, unlike the US constitution (though this later changed with Douglass who thought both undermined slavery).

Again, the speaker repeated that the Bible "got slavery wrong." He simply could not open his eyes as to how incorrect he was. People didn't simply ignore parts of the text, they PROMOTED its words as justice and salvation.
And again, you are only telling half the story.
 
so, folks who think they should have the right to harrass, offend, and attack gay students because the Bible has homophobic passages, got upset that someone didn't agree with their enabling of bigotry?

We know, dude -- for you, whoever's against religion is 100% in the right, and whoever's for any kind of religious accommodation or even tolerance is 100% wrong. That's the extent of your calculus.
 
Abolitionists used the Bible to justify their positions, just as the Southerners used it to justify theirs. The interpretations and rejections of portions of the Bible are acknowledged MORE so by liberals, we see how it can be used for good and evil.

The speaker you and a couple others so defend went much further than saying here was an opportunity to continue that tradition of social justice and spiritual egalitarianism, he said it had no such tradition to begin with. Instead We are expected to merely ignore words, just as others had done, because the Book had gotten everything else "wrong." He said it was a "proslavery" book with no nuance, no acknowledgement of the past liberal and Christian movements which drove the abolitionist movement forward.
 
We know, dude -- for you, whoever's against religion is 100% in the right, and whoever's for any kind of religious accommodation or even tolerance is 100% wrong. That's the extent of your calculus.

why are you being dishonest about my beliefs?

do you think you can make such a dishonest comment and not get challenged on it?

got any evidence, whatsoever, for you silly claim?

I thought not.
 
Isn't that IRONIC!?!.....religious groups came to the US to escape persecution.....but then their followers end up using religion as a justification to persecute another group.

But then again, it isn't the first...or the last....time.

power corrupts. as does freedom.
 
And again, you are only telling half the story.

What other half? The half that demonstrated that the text was used to justify both slavery and ones inferior position in life? I don't deny that in the least.
I'm demonstrating that the speaker and his defenders here seem to not call him out on his selective and exclusionary historical claptrap.
 
Last edited:
The Bible does say that the adulterer should be stoned, and Jesus is conflicted when he says to follow the old testament. Homosexuality is condemned, we are told those who practice it will go to hell, you don't associate with those condemned...hence families renounce their members who do come out, kick them out. Peers do use Leviticus as justification for their bullying. It is documented, to deny it is to deny reality.

Jesus told an adulteress her sins were forgiven and to go and sin no more. Christianity is all about redemption and Christ spent his life associating with sinners. To state that Christians don't associate with people living a sinful lifestyle is ridiculous. Anyone with the slightest knowledge of Christianity realizes that Jesus became man to save the condemned.
 
why are you being dishonest about my beliefs?

do you think you can make such a dishonest comment and not get challenged on it?

got any evidence, whatsoever, for you silly claim?

I thought not.

Yeah. The sum total of your posts regarding same. You contradict yourself all the time in order for it to be just as I describe.
 
Jesus told an adulteress her sins were forgiven and to go and sin no more. Christianity is all about redemption and Christ spent his life associating with sinners. To state that Christians don't associate with people living a sinful lifestyle is ridiculous. Anyone with the slightest knowledge of Christianity realizes that Jesus became man to save the condemned.

and yet, Paul commanded his followers to NOT associate with sinners, and to cast them out.

1st Corinthians 5:11 "But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer a dunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat. What business is it of mine to judge those outside the Church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside. 'Expel the wicked man from among you'".
 
Ignoring the infighting within the thread, I'd venture to say that no one in the OP was correct. Savage and some of the Christian students seem to have gone to the event with an agenda. Savage went to offend and some Christians went to be offended. Frankly, I don't understand why anyone is surprised at what happened. Hell, if I had known about the event and could have bet on it I would be beyond wealthy today.

Extremist meets extremists and people expect peace? LOL!
 
The point is the rationale used by bullies for the continuation of the bullying, ie the Biblical justification.....the topic at hand. Now don't go off and say there are many other justifications used....Savage is not denying that, the focus of his and the topic at hand is the Biblical justification.

who gives a ****? what matters is what actually causes bullying and what can be done to stop it.
 
and yet, Paul commanded his followers to NOT associate with sinners, and to cast them out.

1st Corinthians 5:11 "But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer a dunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat. What business is it of mine to judge those outside the Church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside. 'Expel the wicked man from among you'".

St. Paul was referring to a man who was having sex with his father's wife and refused to stop or repent. The rest of the verse which you omitted goes:"hand the unrepentant man over to Satan so that his sinful nature would be destroyed but his spirit saved on the day of the Lord. Meaning, do not be tempted by his actions. He is not sorry he will not repent so let him indulge in his sinfulness until his life becomes so wretched he will return to God on his own.
In Paul's second letter to the Corinthians we find out that the man became sorrowful and remorseful after being expelled. Once he repented he was welcomed back into the Church.
 
Isn't that IRONIC!?!.....religious groups came to the US to escape persecution.....but then their followers end up using religion as a justification to persecute another group.

But then again, it isn't the first...or the last....time.

Translation: You support state sponsored religious hate speech.
 
so until a sinner repents for his sins, he is unwelcome in the fellowship of God?

interesting.

Its impossible to have fellowship with God without heeding his word. This doesn't mean perfection it means trying. Everyone sins. You have to work at turning away from it to God. If your obstinate and persistent in sin how can you feel welcomed?
 
Back
Top Bottom