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Thread: Another Unarmed Black Man Killed

  1. #81
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    Re: Another Unarmed Black Man Killed

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    So we have someone whose underage and drinking, ignoring attempts for FOURTY FIVE MINUTES of cops trying to get into the location they're at, then proceeds to flee when the owner of the location arrives, and in fleeing decides to trespass onto another person's property and actually entering into an enclosed area on said property, an action his own parents state was likely to elude cops because he had already been ticketed before for underage drinking, ends up getting shot, the cops find no reason to suspect any wrong doing on the part of the home owner.....

    naturally this means we need a thorough additional investigation done on the culpability of the home owner.
    No one has suggested that, as far as I can tell; it doesn't appear that he broke any laws. What people HAVE suggested is that this shows how stupid these kind of laws are in the first place.

    Because as we know, those you use guns are evil


    and they're extra evil and criminal if the person they have to use the gun against happens to be black.
    True or false: If this guy had done exactly the same thing but had looked like Justin Bieber, he wouldn't have gotten killed.

    Answer: Probably true. But we'll never know for sure, and so those who insist on denying the existence of racism (except against whites) will always have plausible deniability.

    Is it a ****ty situation? Yes. Know what else would be a ****ty situation? If rather than some kid acting dumb it had been someone thinking they were going to rob the place and was armed.
    And that might be a reasonable point...in some other scenario. But in this scenario, the shooter knew goddamn well that it was just some kid acting dumb, as he had spoken with the cops about said dumb kids just six minutes prior to the shooting.


    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Gun up to a strangers head and one up to your wife or mother's head....you have to choose one to live...you tell me honestly which you'd choose.
    Right, because some kid hiding in his enclosed porch is clearly the same as him pointing a gun at his wife's head.

    Situation like that you're stuck with a scenario where you either err on the side of caution for the life of the person invading your property or err on the side of caution for the life of you and your loved ones. I find it despicable that you seek to insult and degrade those that would put their loved ones lives ahead of those who are acting in the wrong.
    First of all, the guy wasn't even intruding in his house. It's not like he was prowling around the living room; he was in an enclosed porch. Now you can pretend that there's no distinction if you'd like (and legally, perhaps there isn't under Wisconsin law), but you and I both know perfectly well that the two are not the same thing, and one is clearly far more threatening than the other. The reasonable course of action is to go down and tell the kid to get lost. Or if for some reason he's too terrified to do that, he could call the cops again (who he just spoke to six minutes earlier and who were already in the vicinity) and tell THEM to go to the porch and tell the kid to get lost. Or if for some reason he's too terrified to even wait THAT long, he could go downstairs with his gun and lock the door to his house to make sure the guy didn't come inside. All of which are better options than gunning down an unarmed guy who wasn't threatening the homeowner in any way whatsoever.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 04-20-12 at 02:01 PM.
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  2. #82
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    Re: Another Unarmed Black Man Killed

    Quote Originally Posted by ric27 View Post
    I'm thinking...

    It's the guy on my porch thats not thinking
    I don't think you are serious. Let's say it's dark out and raining. A guy a mile down the road breaks down and has no cell phone reception and he comes by your house. He knocks and no answer, but he realizes that you have wifi, uses it, and is texting someone for help. You happen to wake up and you see him standing out there, so instead of yelling "Hey who goes there?", calling the police, or hell firing a warning shot you go right for the kill?
    "We’re going to close the unproductive tax loopholes that allow some of the truly wealthy to avoid paying their fair share. In theory, some of those loopholes were understandable, but in practice they sometimes made it possible for millionaires to pay nothing, while a bus driver was paying ten percent of his salary, and that’s crazy." -Reagan

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    Re: Another Unarmed Black Man Killed

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    No, baby...I'm not 'implying' anything. I'm stating directly you don give a **** about them or these two individuals. You 'care' about a cause. Nothin more.
    Baby? Sorry dude I'm straight. What is my cause? I'm just curious. Had it been a white guy shot by a black guy, I would be just as indifferent on it. I totally understand someone breaking and entering your house but someone just hanging out on your porch, I would load a gun, call a cop and point the gun at the door while I rock in my rocking chair.

    Do you actually read anything I ever post, or do you just care about your cause and nothing more?
    "We’re going to close the unproductive tax loopholes that allow some of the truly wealthy to avoid paying their fair share. In theory, some of those loopholes were understandable, but in practice they sometimes made it possible for millionaires to pay nothing, while a bus driver was paying ten percent of his salary, and that’s crazy." -Reagan

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    Re: Another Unarmed Black Man Killed

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnWOlin View Post
    I don't think you are serious. Let's say it's dark out and raining. A guy a mile down the road breaks down and has no cell phone reception and he comes by your house. He knocks and no answer, but he realizes that you have wifi, uses it, and is texting someone for help. You happen to wake up and you see him standing out there, so instead of yelling "Hey who goes there?", calling the police, or hell firing a warning shot you go right for the kill?
    LOL!!!

    Hypothetical much???
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    Re: Another Unarmed Black Man Killed

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    First of all, the guy wasn't even intruding in his house. It's not like he was prowling around the living room; he was in an enclosed porch. Now you can pretend that there's no distinction if you'd like (and legally, perhaps there isn't under Wisconsin law), but you and I both know perfectly well that the two are not the same thing, and one is clearly far more threatening than the other. The reasonable course of action is to go down and tell the kid to get lost. Or if for some reason he's too terrified to do that, he could call the cops again (who he just spoke to six minutes earlier and who were already in the vicinity) and tell THEM to go to the porch and tell the kid to get lost. Or if for some reason he's too terrified to even wait THAT long, he could go downstairs with his gun and lock the door to his house to make sure the guy didn't come inside. All of which are better options than gunning down an unarmed guy who wasn't threatening the homeowner in any way whatsoever.
    Kandahar, any home I've ever been in or owned that's had an enclosed porch is just exactly like being in the house. Our home in suburban Chicago had an enclosed porch right off the living room. There was a half-assed door from the porch to the living room that was hardly ever locked. If you'd ever had an enclosed porch, you'd know that.

    The whole purpose of Castle Laws is so people can't do exactly what you're doing. "He didn't have to shoot. He could've done such-and-such-and-such-and-such. You weren't there. You don't know. You break into someone's enclosed porch? You sneak in and have the appearance of lying in wait? You're liable to get killed. Self Defense 101.
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    Re: Another Unarmed Black Man Killed

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnWOlin View Post
    Baby? Sorry dude I'm straight. What is my cause? I'm just curious. Had it been a white guy shot by a black guy, I would be just as indifferent on it. I totally understand someone breaking and entering your house but someone just hanging out on your porch, I would load a gun, call a cop and point the gun at the door while I rock in my rocking chair.

    Do you actually read anything I ever post, or do you just care about your cause and nothing more?
    This is exactly the responsible thing to do. You prep yourself in case you need to protect yourself and call the police who are trained to handle the situation. I don't understand why this is something people don't agree on. This seems so obvious.

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    Re: Another Unarmed Black Man Killed

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    No, baby...I'm not 'implying' anything. I'm stating directly you don give a **** about them or these two individuals. You 'care' about a cause. Nothin more.
    Let's not pretend that you give a damn about them either (unless you know them personally). You care about this because it simultaneously pushes two conservative buttons: 1) The opportunity to defend a white guy against probably accurate allegations of racism, and 2) The opportunity to stand up for the right to gun down anyone who wrongs you in the slightest.

    I hate to make blanket statements like "all conservatives are X, Y, and Z"...but lately I am finding fewer and fewer exceptions to whom the above statements do not apply. Paranoia and just generally being a dick to people now seem to be the cornerstones of conservative ideology.
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    Re: Another Unarmed Black Man Killed

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Kandahar, any home I've ever been in or owned that's had an enclosed porch is just exactly like being in the house. Our home in suburban Chicago had an enclosed porch right off the living room. There was a half-assed door from the porch to the living room that was hardly ever locked.
    If you think someone is in your enclosed porch who shouldn't be there, then there is a simply solution to that problem: Lock the door. This guy was apparently brave enough to open the door, go out to the enclosed porch, confront the guy, and shoot him dead. Yet it would just be too terrifying to stop and LOCK the door instead?
    Last edited by Kandahar; 04-20-12 at 02:23 PM.
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    Re: Another Unarmed Black Man Killed

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    I hate to make blanket statements like "all conservatives are X, Y, and Z"...but lately I am finding fewer and fewer exceptions to whom the above statements do not apply. Paranoia and just generally being a dick to people now seem to be the cornerstones of conservative ideology.
    No, that's pretty much our interpretation because we're on a highly partisan political debate site. And, I'd remind you, that "just generally being a dick to people" is not reserved for the Right. IRL, most people could care less.
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    Re: Another Unarmed Black Man Killed

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    If you think someone is in your enclosed porch who shouldn't be there, then there is a simply solution to that problem: Lock the door. This guy was apparently brave enough to OPEN the door, go out to the enclosed porch, confront the guy, and shoot him dead. Yet it would just be too terrifying to stop and LOCK the door instead?
    Yep. When I was a kid, I opened our backdoor to get in the car to go to school. When I opened it, a man ran into our garage. We had two guns in our house, but instead of getting them and shooting the guy as a first or second resort, we closed the door, locked it and called the police. He was alive, we were alive, he went to jail. Sounds good to me. Guns are a last resort - always.

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