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Thread: Deal OKs bill requiring drug testing for welfare recipients

  1. #71
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    Re: Deal OKs bill requiring drug testing for welfare recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by Paratrooper View Post
    Aren't welfare entitlements intended to get someone back on their feet, not be a lifetime free paycheck?

    If someone is doing drugs they are being counter productive because they are taking possible employment off the table ( jobs that require someone to be drug free which are many).

    As for the children ( I don't think people should be allowed to have children if they don't have the means to provide for them, but that's a topic for another day).

    If a parent spends their entitlement money on drugs instead of taking care of their family then the children should be relocated to another family or foster care. The parent who does drugs is the one that causes this hardship for the children not the government. No one is forcing them to do drugs.
    Sounds a little too intrusive for my taste. What should be done is this: Take all of that money wasted on drug testing welfare recipients and put it towards solving the problems that cause people to be on welfare. Whether that be more government sponsored job training, more safe sex awareness, or anti-drug enforcement/education. Fix those things and you will see less people on welfare.

    I don't have any problem with a person raising X amount of kids relaxing with a joint at the end of the day without having to worry about losing all assistance.
    Hail to the King baby!

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    Re: Deal OKs bill requiring drug testing for welfare recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Should they be able to buy cigarettes?
    That is not food or drink and as such irrelevent. If they do buy cigarettes then that is with their own money. Not with government money.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Believe me, I know the problems associated with having a record. And I believe reform is needed in that department.

    But again, ignoring a problem is just as worthless as spending less money.
    what part of intervention before things get bad is ignoring the problem?

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    Re: Deal OKs bill requiring drug testing for welfare recipients

    What gets me about these conversations is that most of the supporters of drug testing are basing their opinions on outdated information. Like the term welfare is outdated. It is now called Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) If you read the information in that link you will learn that you cannot be permanently on TANF. And that there are already tough requirements for being on TANF. There are work requirements in place.

    With few exceptions, recipients must work as soon as they are job-ready or no later than two years after coming on assistance.
    To count toward a State’s work participation rate, single parents must participate in work activities for an average of 30 hours per week, or an average of 20 hours per week if they have a child under age six. Two-parent families must participate in work activities for an average of 35 hours a week or, if they receive Federal child care assistance, 55 hours a week.
    Failure to participate in work requirements can result in a reduction or termination of a family’s benefits.

    [....]

    Five-Year Time Limit:
    Families with an adult who has received federally-funded assistance for a total of five years (or less at state option) are not eligible for cash aid under the TANF program.

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    Re: Deal OKs bill requiring drug testing for welfare recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Hey, I might be more sympathetic in this thread if people didn't want to ban welfare recipients from buying certain kinds of food/drink just because they are welfare recipients.
    I don't go for the drug testing thing because I believe that "innocent until proven guilty" is (supposed to be) one of our core societal values. If we're not willing to live it ourselves in our daily lives, then it's all just mindless prattle. And no, even though a private business can get away with it, I don't approve of it there, either. (Barring narrowly-defined exceptions) So, if my standards are that regarding drug testing, I sure as hell don't approve of restricting otherwise legal purchases.

    Be that as it may, I think the two are different enough that they shouldn't be lumped together. One, food/drink, are legal purchases. The other, drugs, is not. While I prefer the "innocent until proven guilty" route, I do see the distinction between legal and illegal. IOW: I don't think someone would automatically be inconsistent if they favored drug testing while opposing legal purchase restrictions.

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    Re: Deal OKs bill requiring drug testing for welfare recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    what part of intervention before things get bad is ignoring the problem?
    When I said "ignoring the problem" I am talking about letting people that use drugs get welfare. That is ignoring a problem.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Re: Deal OKs bill requiring drug testing for welfare recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    When I said "ignoring the problem" I am talking about letting people that use drugs get welfare. That is ignoring a problem.
    The problem is with the amount of people on welfare.
    Hail to the King baby!

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    I feel like we are taking everything that made this country great, balling it up, and throwing it in the trash.

    What happened to hard work and personal responsibility.?

    People with no job having five kids and then expecting the rest of us to pick up the tab?

    I heard on the radio yesterday in 2010 only 81 million people paid taxes.

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    Re: Deal OKs bill requiring drug testing for welfare recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Personal responsibility is still around, but when discussing government actions, it's more irrational to focus on what the government can do rather than what it cannot do. It can't force people to be personally responsible so that doesn't even factor into this discussion.
    Meant "rational", not "irrational". haha, oops.
    Last edited by ThePlayDrive; 04-19-12 at 02:25 PM.

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    Re: Deal OKs bill requiring drug testing for welfare recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    You're right, we can't force personal responsibility. But we also do not have to support personal irresponsibility.
    If "not supporting personal irresponsibility" has great costs with little benefit to society, then "not supporting personal irresponsibility" seems like a bad choice. The costs of people on drugs using welfare will simply be replaced by the cost of drug tests and the costs of dealing with the children of those who fail the tests.

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