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Thread: O'Keefe Voter Fraud Investigation: Young Man Offered Holder's Ballot

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    Re: O'Keefe Voter Fraud Investigation: Young Man Offered Holder's Ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by nonpareil View Post
    Partisans usually see only one side of the story. The other side is people who are prevented or discouraged form voting because of the law and it's telling when your reply failed to address that. I provided statistics of a bigger picture, if you want to play count the anecdotal evidence, play it with thinkprogress who counted 9 to your 8: REPORT: Nine People Denied Voting Rights By Voter ID Laws | ThinkProgress

    Happy now?

    8 "Incidents" which include more than one person in some of those "incidents"...

    and nine people.

    Your Math Rulez All!
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

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    Re: O'Keefe Voter Fraud Investigation: Young Man Offered Holder's Ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Just because people don't have ID's does not mean that they cannot get one.
    Unless they don't have all the documents required or are too hassled by all of it. I had to run around getting letters from my school and the bank to get the license. Basically, they make it harder for the group of people who just might put off voting all together, all so that they can prevent a type of fraud that is estimated to be less than 0.0001. If the demographics of those likely to be discouraged by the law is true and you vote Republican, your vote is definitely going to be more effectiveness with the law, but it's through raising a barrier to voting - the effect is as good as disenfranchising.
    Quote Originally Posted by Free_Radical View Post

    And I wasn't making an appeal to authority, I was making an appeal to the philosophical body of work of the founders, the worth and content of which should be well-known to anyone with a cursory understanding of basic history and philosophy.

    Brian

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    Re: O'Keefe Voter Fraud Investigation: Young Man Offered Holder's Ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by nonpareil View Post
    Unless they don't have all the documents required or are too hassled by all of it. I had to run around getting letters from my school and the bank to get the license. Basically, they make it harder for the group of people who just might put off voting all together, all so that they can prevent a type of fraud that is estimated to be less than 0.0001. If the demographics of those likely to be discouraged by the law is true and you vote Republican, your vote is definitely going to be more effectiveness with the law, but it's through raising a barrier to voting - the effect is as good as disenfranchising.
    Bolded Above:

    Alternate Meaning: Too Lazy to get one.
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

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    Re: O'Keefe Voter Fraud Investigation: Young Man Offered Holder's Ballot

    The state of North Carolina requires a whole TWO (2) documents to show who you are and 1 to show residency to obtain a basic "ID" card.

    All this stuff about school and blah to get your driver's license is meaningless.

    Even homeless folks can get an ID card with those above documents and 10 bucks.
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

  5. #145
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    Re: O'Keefe Voter Fraud Investigation: Young Man Offered Holder's Ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    8 "Incidents" which include more than one person in some of those "incidents"...

    and nine people.

    Your Math Rulez All!

    Telling that you think that the anecdotal evidence is to be taken seriously. It's not my maths that's the problem, it's your lack of understanding of statistics.

    BTW, he showed cases of vote buying and absentee ballots, which would not be addressed by the photo ID requirement. Thinkprogress at least document the people who were actually affected by the photo ID requirement. It just highlight the bull**** surrounding the issue. The Republicans is not tackling the absentee ballot issue, since those voters favour them, instead they go after the voters that are known to favour the Democrats. The Democrats play the same game, and both sides work by disenfranchsing the people who they think won't vote for them instead of trying to come up with policy that would pull these voters towards them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Free_Radical View Post

    And I wasn't making an appeal to authority, I was making an appeal to the philosophical body of work of the founders, the worth and content of which should be well-known to anyone with a cursory understanding of basic history and philosophy.

    Brian

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    Re: O'Keefe Voter Fraud Investigation: Young Man Offered Holder's Ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    The state of North Carolina requires a whole TWO (2) documents to show who you are and 1 to show residency to obtain a basic "ID" card.

    All this stuff about school and blah to get your driver's license is meaningless.

    Even homeless folks can get an ID card with those above documents and 10 bucks.
    Tell that to the 96 years old whose application was denied because she didn't have her marriage certificate. Your "years in law enforcement" means nothing when the facts plainly contradict your claim.
    Quote Originally Posted by Free_Radical View Post

    And I wasn't making an appeal to authority, I was making an appeal to the philosophical body of work of the founders, the worth and content of which should be well-known to anyone with a cursory understanding of basic history and philosophy.

    Brian

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    Re: O'Keefe Voter Fraud Investigation: Young Man Offered Holder's Ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by nonpareil View Post
    Tell that to the 96 years old whose application was denied because she didn't have her marriage certificate. Your "years in law enforcement" means nothing when the facts plainly contradict your claim.
    Umm... whut?

    Don't need a marriage certificate to get an ID in North Carolina.

    You did read where I said that in my post you replied to right?

    EDIT: I just realized you tossed me a bone to which you would reply with info about her name change. Didn't think of that at first. She could very easily go GET her Marriage certificate from the Register of Deeds.
    Last edited by Caine; 04-11-12 at 11:56 PM.
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

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    Re: O'Keefe Voter Fraud Investigation: Young Man Offered Holder's Ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Quag View Post
    Um no... the cameras in the home and strip searches are invasive and pointless. As one of our Prime ministers said so eloquently. The state has no buisness in the bedrooms of the nation.
    However when you are voting you are doing something public, ie taking part in the selection process of the people who will run the country. There is absolutely no way you can come close to comparing it to placing cameras in peoples homes or randomly strip searching them. It could be considered similar to requiring a drivers licence when you drive however.

    BTW I would be against creating a seperate photo ID for voting. I think that would be a waste of taxpayer $$$. But I don't see how requiring some form of ID would be onerous. Again see the link posted above on what canada requires.

    I do not think you need proof of massive voter fraud to think this is a good idea. All you need is proof of the possibility, then if measures can be easily enacted to countervent this then why not? Again I would be against issuing a photo Voter ID card as it would make life more difficult and is a compelte waste of $$$. I will repeat I"m not American I don't pretend to know what is proposed but from reading OP and subsequnt posts no mention of this voter photo ID came up untill jsut recently.
    No, you need to show that the cost of doing so would not outweight the gain, the cost in this case is the people who would be prevented or discouraged from voting by the law VS the gain of stopping actual or any imaginary fraud that can be stopped by this law. A lot of the fraud that are done would not be stopped by the law, while the number of people who could be prevented or discouraged from voting by the law can be quite high.
    Quote Originally Posted by Free_Radical View Post

    And I wasn't making an appeal to authority, I was making an appeal to the philosophical body of work of the founders, the worth and content of which should be well-known to anyone with a cursory understanding of basic history and philosophy.

    Brian

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    Re: O'Keefe Voter Fraud Investigation: Young Man Offered Holder's Ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Umm... whut?

    Don't need a marriage certificate to get an ID in North Carolina.

    You did read where I said that in my post you replied to right?

    EDIT: I just realized you tossed me a bone to which you would reply with info about her name change. Didn't think of that at first. She could very easily go GET her Marriage certificate from the Register of Deeds.
    Tell that to the 96 years old whose application was denied. The issue is not valid just in N Carolina.
    Last edited by nonpareil; 04-12-12 at 12:05 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Free_Radical View Post

    And I wasn't making an appeal to authority, I was making an appeal to the philosophical body of work of the founders, the worth and content of which should be well-known to anyone with a cursory understanding of basic history and philosophy.

    Brian

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    Re: O'Keefe Voter Fraud Investigation: Young Man Offered Holder's Ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by nonpareil View Post
    Tell that to the 96 years old whose application was denied. The issue is not valid just in N Carolina.
    Okay... Tell me where to find her and I will!
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

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