View Poll Results: Who bombed the Wisonsin Planned Parenthood?

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  • A conservative, who is against PP

    11 20.37%
  • A liberal, who wants PP back in the news

    1 1.85%
  • I haven't a clue

    7 12.96%
  • I don't care. I just want this criminal arrested

    35 64.81%
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Thread: A Planned Parenthood Clinic In Wisconsin Was BOMBED Last Night

  1. #161
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    Re: A Planned Parenthood Clinic In Wisconsin Was BOMBED Last Night

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    The RCRC was founded in 1973 by the United Methodist clergy and lay leaders.


    RCRC and UMC: 35 Years of Partnership
    and that does nothing to change the fact that the RCRC is not the UMC, and that the UMC official position is clearly different than the RCRC ....


    Why you would continue to promote this idea when I directly cited the official UMC website is beyond me

  2. #162
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    Re: A Planned Parenthood Clinic In Wisconsin Was BOMBED Last Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    and that does nothing to change the fact that the RCRC is not the UMC, and that the UMC official position is clearly different than the RCRC ....
    The United Methodist Church founded the RCRC and is a member of the RCRC.


    WHEREAS, The United Methodist Church was a founding member of the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice in 1973, and


    WHEREAS, the General Board of Church and Society and the Women's Division of the General Board of Global Ministries are currently members of the Religious Coalition, along with national organizations from 14 denominations, including the Episcopal Church, Presbyterian Church (USA), United Church of Christ, Unitarian Universalism, Reform and Conservative Judaism, and

    WHEREAS, these Coalition member organizations hold a wide variety of views regarding policies relating to specific issues of reproductive choice such as when life and personhood begins but, nevertheless, share common religious values, have official pro-choice policies, and are committed to working together to ensure reproductive choice for all persons through the moral power of religious communities, and


    WHEREAS, the Religious Coalition supports the right of all persons to have access to a wide range of reproductive health services including sexuality education, family planning services, contraception, abortion services, affordable and quality health and child care, and

    WHEREAS, the Religious Coalition's All Options Clergy Counseling program trains clergy of many faiths to assist women in discerning the course of action that they believe is best in a case of unintended pregnancy, and

    WHEREAS, internationally, the Religious Coalition is an accredited non-governmental organization with the United Nations Department of Public Information which supports international family planning services in such areas as South Africa where the Coalition works with churches on HIV/AIDS education and prevention, and

    WHEREAS, the Coalition's efforts help counter attempts to enact restrictive legislation that would impose specific religious views about abortion and reproductive health on persons of all faiths, and


    WHEREAS, factions within the United Methodist Church whose stated goal is to have the General Conference go on record in opposition to all abortions regardless of the reason are working towards the goal of severing all United Methodist ties with the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice;

    Therefore, be it resolved, that the United Methodist 2004 General Conference go on record in support of the work of the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice, and

    Be it further resolved, that the 2004 General Conference affirm the continued membership of the General Board of Church and Society and the Women's Division of the General Board of Global Ministries in the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice.
    Support for the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice
    Last edited by minnie616; 09-26-13 at 01:55 PM.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

  3. #163
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    Re: A Planned Parenthood Clinic In Wisconsin Was BOMBED Last Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    and that does nothing to change the fact that the RCRC is not the UMC, and that the UMC official position is clearly different than the RCRC ....
    Do you not understand the part I bolded ?


    While RCRC member groups have diverse views on the issue of abortion, grounded in their religious traditions, they work together to ensure that individuals will be able to follow their own conscience and beliefs.
    It means that different churches have different viwes on the issues of abortion but that all of the member churces and groups want to keep abortion legal so that each religious church or group , individual members and others can follow their view on the issue of abortion.

    That is after all what pro choice is all about.

    Pro choice IS NOT pro abortion.
    Last edited by minnie616; 09-26-13 at 02:12 PM.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

  4. #164
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    Re: A Planned Parenthood Clinic In Wisconsin Was BOMBED Last Night

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    The United Methodist Church founded the RCRC and is a member of the RCRC.
    How does that change the fact that I just posted the UMC position, from the official UMC website, and it is clearly different than the RCRCs?


    WHEREAS, these Coalition member organizations hold a wide variety of views regarding policies relating to specific issues of reproductive choice such as when life and personhood begins but, nevertheless, share common religious values, have official pro-choice policies
    1) Note that it clearly outlines coalition members have "a wide variety of views regarding policies related to reproductive choice". What this means, is that while the coalition may hold a particular view, as a coalition, individual members still are free to establish their own policy, like the UMC clearly does

    2) Are you seriously going to argue that being against abortion, besides in circumstances where the mother's health is at risk, is what you consider pro-choice? I think we both know any answer besides "no" would be complete bull****.

  5. #165
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    Re: A Planned Parenthood Clinic In Wisconsin Was BOMBED Last Night

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    Do you not understand the part I bolded ?
    Yes, do you? Do you not understand how coalitions and branch organizations work? Because it really seems you are struggling with these concepts


    It means that different churches have different viwes on the issues of abortion but that all of the member churces and groups want to keep abortion legal so that each religious church or group , individual members and others can follow their view on the issue of abortion.
    No, it means they all support legal abortion ***to some degree***. In the UMC's case, as was made clear on their official website, that degree is "when the mother's health is at risk". Clearly a position I never read you defining as pro-choice in the past. In fact, quite the opposite.

  6. #166
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    Re: A Planned Parenthood Clinic In Wisconsin Was BOMBED Last Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post

    No, it means they all support legal abortion ***to some degree***. In the UMC's case, as was made clear on their official website, that degree is "when the mother's health is at risk". Clearly a position I never read you defining as pro-choice in the past. In fact, quite the opposite.
    I support abortion when a woman's health is at risk.
    I also support abortion when a fetus would be stillborn or is so malformed it would only live a few minutes or hours.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

  7. #167
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    Re: A Planned Parenthood Clinic In Wisconsin Was BOMBED Last Night

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    Of course I support abortion when a woman's health is at risk.
    I also support abortion when a fetus would be stillborn or is so malformed it would only live a few minutes or hours.
    Way to give a complete non-answer: The obvious question was (actually implication) was that in no other circumstance would you describe a position that limits legal abortion to issues of the mother's health as pro-choice.

  8. #168
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    Re: A Planned Parenthood Clinic In Wisconsin Was BOMBED Last Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    Way to give a complete non-answer: The obvious question was (actually implication) was that in no other circumstance would you describe a position that limits legal abortion to issues of the mother's health as pro-choice.
    It is pro choice.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

  9. #169
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    Re: A Planned Parenthood Clinic In Wisconsin Was BOMBED Last Night

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    The RCRC supports reproductive choices for women.

    United Methodist was one the founders of RCRC back in 1973.
    In August of 2012 the United Methodist Women’s national policymaking body and the General Board of Church and Society jointly filed a brief in support of general church agencies’ continued work with the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice.

    Read more:

    UMW-Press Release - United Methodist Women National Policymaking Body Files Joint Brief on Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice
    United Methodist Women =/= United Methodist Church, which, as I stated, allows for Abortion in case of severe fetal disfigurement incompatible with life (ie: not things like Downs Syndrome), or the life of the mother, but does not support it for birth control.

    The Biblical Basis for
    Being Pro-Choice

    The Bible never mentions abortion, but it does offer support for choice.[/B]


    read more:

    The Biblical Basis for Being Pro-Choice: Bible, abortion, Christians, religion - Beliefnet.com
    I'm sorry, but if this is the best they have then you are in trouble - if anything, this is even a worse argument than the "metamorphosis" piece of ludicrosity that got posted a while back. Both Old and New Testament place the beginning of our lives in the womb, for them to say that the Bible does not address it is a piece of willful blindness.

  10. #170
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    Re: A Planned Parenthood Clinic In Wisconsin Was BOMBED Last Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    Yes, do you? Do you not understand how coalitions and branch organizations work? Because it really seems you are struggling with these concepts

    No, it means they all support legal abortion ***to some degree***. In the UMC's case, as was made clear on their official website, that degree is "when the mother's health is at risk". Clearly a position I never read you defining as pro-choice in the past. In fact, quite the opposite.
    It makes me seriously wonder about the actual positions of the other membership - do they even know that they are on this list? Or has the RCRC simply taken support statements from groups within them like the UMW and treated them as authoritative?

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