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Thread: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

  1. #61
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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    And the moral here is: Don't trust the media, don't trust other posters, only trust yourself.

    Sad actually but that's reality.
    I have found that we have posters here who have both cited the CBO as evidence of a thing, and in other threads claimed that the CBO is unreliable and not evidence of a single thing. So yes, best to trust to your own intellect.

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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Gie View Post
    So far as I can tell every reputable news source in the country has reported the same thing. That projected cost have doubled and furthermore (though I can't recall which candidate said it at which one) this was part of the discussion at one of the debates. The projected cost have doubled, it will be an election issue and IMO anyone wishing to live in a bubble and not acknowledge the fact will have a hard time doing so in coming days. In fact if I were a betting man I'd bet you real money that we still have not seen what the true cost will be and the final cost will far exceed "double" what was billed, in the end.
    the estimate is 195% of what it was
    what you have failed to have observed is that the new estimate covers a period 167% of what it was
    this larger number covers a larger number of years than the old estimate
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    the estimate is 195% of what it was
    what you have failed to have observed is that the new estimate covers a period 167% of what it was
    this larger number covers a larger number of years than the old estimate
    That was the whole point of the OP's article:

    ... to delay full implementation of the law until 2014, so it would appear cheaper under the CBO's standard ten-year budget window and, at least on paper, meet Obama's pledge that the legislation would cost "around $900 billion over 10 years."

    Today, the CBO released new projections from 2013 extending through 2022, and the results are as critics expected: the ten-year cost of the law's core provisions to expand health insurance coverage has now ballooned to $1.76 trillion. That's because we now have estimates for Obamacare's first nine years of full implementation, rather than the mere six when it was signed into law. Only next year will we get a true ten-year cost estimate
    All gross costs are rounding errors prior to 2014.

    PS: It's actually 150%
    Last edited by Rhapsody1447; 03-14-12 at 05:05 PM.
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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhapsody1447 View Post
    Wrong. Reference the actual report, they are both gross figures:

    March 2010 (Table 2)

    Attachment 67124061

    March 2012 (Table 2)

    Attachment 67124062

    There is nothing factually incorrect in the OP's article.
    I stand corrected.
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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhapsody1447 View Post
    That was the whole point of the OP's article:



    All gross costs are rounding errors prior to 2014.

    PS: It's actually 150%
    no, the focus was on the expanded estimate

    no context was provided to explain that those more costly numbers represented additional years, too
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    no, the focus was on the expanded estimate

    no context was provided to explain that those more costly numbers represented additional years, too
    Well if you white-out the direct quote from the article they don't....

    "That's because we now have estimates for Obamacare's first nine years of full implementation, rather than the mere six when it was signed into law. Only next year will we get a true ten-year cost estimate"
    "There is an excellent correlation between giving society what it wants and making money, and almost no correlation between the desire to make money and how much money one makes." ~Dalio

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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhapsody1447 View Post
    Well if you white-out the direct quote from the article they don't....

    "That's because we now have estimates for Obamacare's first nine years of full implementation, rather than the mere six when it was signed into law. Only next year will we get a true ten-year cost estimate"
    here you go. the OP's opening remarks
    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    ....that is almost double what we were told as the dang thing was being passed.

    Everyone who was foolish enough to buy the line of BS about how "Obamacare will lower the deficit"..... Here's your sign.



    and again. as cpwill keeps saying. Obamacare will never be fully implemented. not because of politics, or the supreme court, or anything else, but just plain because we can't. we do not have the fiscal capacity to add this putrid oozing monstrosity to the pile of entitlements we are already sinking under.
    i put in bold his focus, the projected cost increase
    now, point out where he placed that in context to indicate those revised numbers included more years covering health care
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    ....that is almost double what we were told as the dang thing was being passed.

    Everyone who was foolish enough to buy the line of BS about how "Obamacare will lower the deficit"..... Here's your sign.
    Let's chill for a moment and take a look at what the CBO actually said. First of all, it's misleading for the author of the op-ed to make the following assertion: "President Obama's national health care law will cost $1.76 trillion over a decade, according to a new projection released today by the Congressional Budget Office, rather than the $940 billion forecast when it was signed into law." This incorrectly makes it seem as though the budget estimate has worsened considerably, when that isn't the case. The reason that the projection for the NEXT ten years (i.e. 2012-2022) looks worse than the original ten-year projection (i.e. 2010-2020) is because we are two years closer to the main provisions actually taking effect in 2014. So naturally the costs over the next decade will be more than they originally were. As the CBO's report says:

    The addition of 2022 to the projection period has the effect of increasing the costs of the coverage provisions of the ACA relative to those projected in March 2011 for the 20122021 period because that change adds a year in which the expansion of eligibility for Medicaid and subsidies for health insurance purchased through the exchanges will be in effect.
    This wasn't a surprise, it's been part of their estimates since the beginning. The budget picture for equivalent time periods has actually improved slightly ($38 billion) since their last estimate last year. And again, the reasons for this don't have much to do with the ACA itself...they're mostly due to external factors: 1) New legislation which slightly reduced the cost of the ACA, 2) A worse economic outlook which slightly increased the cost of the ACA, 3) A slower growth in private insurance premiums which slightly reduced the cost of the ACA.

    and again. as cpwill keeps saying. Obamacare will never be fully implemented. not because of politics, or the supreme court, or anything else, but just plain because we can't. we do not have the fiscal capacity to add this putrid oozing monstrosity to the pile of entitlements we are already sinking under.
    The United States (including governments, corporations, and individuals) spends $2.5 trillion per year on health care. At its peak, the ACA is projected to cost $169 billion per year...or less than 7% our total health care spending. And even most of THAT isn't new spending...it's just a transfer of costs from individuals/businesses to the government. People have to spend their money on health care some way or another. If not through the ACA, then through individual insurance premiums, or through lower salaries to pay for health benefits, or through not having health insurance and getting sick more often and dying sooner. So let's not pretend that this is some brand new cost that just came out of nowhere. If we can't afford the ACA, then we certainly can't afford our existing model of health care.
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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhapsody1447 View Post
    That was the whole point of the OP's article:
    no, the focus was on the expanded estimate

    no context was provided to explain that those more costly numbers represented additional years, too
    Notice the context. I clearly stated that the point of the article was to expose the accounting gimmicks that pushed the full 10-year cost estimate out by four years. Now that we are beginning to get an idea of what the actual 10-year cost of the program is, it exposes the misleading statements made by the President:

    Now, add it all up, and the plan I'm proposing will cost around $900 billion over 10 years -- less than we have spent on the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, and less than the tax cuts for the wealthiest few Americans that Congress passed at the beginning of the previous administration.
    It wasn't technically a lie, but it's purposely misleading due to the fact that the program isn't even operating for four out of the ten years the President is referencing. The point of the article was to expose this accounting trick for what it is. If you want to look at the 10-year cost of a program you have to start counting when the program is actually implemented.
    "There is an excellent correlation between giving society what it wants and making money, and almost no correlation between the desire to make money and how much money one makes." ~Dalio

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    My paycheck says I am paying for it. Still not sure how the crap the poster may have gone through is my problem to pay for.
    You aren't paying for his insurance.

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