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Thread: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by xpiher View Post
    Then you need to do some more research. Start with hmos

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    Yeah, HMOs that were created by....? The government created HMOs. Most people don't know that.

    So here you cite a government created problem, and claim government is the solution? Err... no.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkles View Post
    Yeah, HMOs that were created by....? The government created HMOs. Most people don't know that.

    So here you cite a government created problem, and claim government is the solution? Err... no.
    Never said the gov was the answer for how to run the programs. Saying that a program can't kick you off when you get sick because the system is broken is a justfiable intervention. It will take government action to fix the system because of how broken the system is due to monopolies, slanted rules, the fact employers pay directly for health care and demand personal involvement, etc

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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by xpiher View Post
    Never said the gov was the answer for how to run the programs. Saying that a program can't kick you off when you get sick because the system is broken is a justfiable intervention. It will take government action to fix the system because of how broken the system is due to monopolies, slanted rules, the fact employers pay directly for health care and demand personal involvement, etc

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    And every country that has plunged into a socialist 3rd world ruins, has always used the exact same justification for their own destruction. Only government can provide clean water, and for 50 years the majority of Indians didn't have access to clean water. Now they have a capitalist system in place, and clean water is being provided throughout the country, not completely, but a higher percentage than ever before.

    So here we are with the same justification. Only government can fix health care. Really? You realize that health care is already the 3rd most highly regulated sector in the US?

    Remember how Airlines were highly regulated prior to the 1970s? What happened after deregulation? Cheaper airfare, and more access to air travel to more people, than ever before. Now commuter jets are filled, instead of running half empty with government subsidies. (except in political pork districts which still get subsidized air travel).

    Funny how deregulation didn't ruin the airline industry. Funny how the lack of regulation doesn't ruin 99% of the products in our stores.

    Yet in this case, in an industry already highly regulated, we have huge problems. And yet your claim is, only more regulation and intervention can fix those problems.

    Well I disagree. I think the regulation we have are the direct cause of our problems. More regulation has never fixed anything, will only make things worse.

    Look at India. They have a massive socialized care system, and it's junk. But then they have these private pay-for-service hospitals, that people all over the world are flying there to get to. Why? What are they doing differently that is draw people all over the world?

    They don't have government control. Same in Singapore. Dozens of government run hospital, and only the private non-government-controlled hospitals are attracting people from all over the world.

    I would dare you to give one district in one state, complete exemption from all government regulations. No medicare, no medicaid, no rules, no regulations. And lets see what happens. I would bet you anything, the price of care at those hospitals and clinics would drop like a rock. They would have more services, and lower costs, in a matter of months.

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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by xpiher View Post
    That's because the only access to the net I have at this time is on my phone. Anyways, the basic premise is that health insurance unintentionally drives up prices because no onebegin huntswhile at the same time screwing people over by refusing to cover various treatments

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    So how does that keep me from paying for others healthcare? The govt takes money from me in taxes, and then spends it on medicaid. That is direct transfer of wealth.

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    Re: New CBO health law estimate shows much higher spending past first 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhapsody1447 View Post
    That's the point. That's why conservatives only care about the gross cost estimates. They recognize that revenue projections in 2021, and consequently "deficit savings", are completely unreliable. Frankly the fact that the CBO predicts it will "save" an extra $48 billion over the next 10 years is irrelevant in comparison to the projection it will cost an extra $822 billion.
    too bad conservatives didn't properly estimate the cost of the last IRAQ war and give congress a chance to fund it in advance....by taxing gasoline and diesel....
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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkles View Post
    And every country that has plunged into a socialist 3rd world ruins, has always used the exact same justification for their own destruction. .
    elaborate? what country has plunged into 3rd world ruins due to socialism or social programs?
    For under $100 per month per family, Canadians have adequate health care. Are they 3rd world? How about the many countries in Europe that provide health care and other social needs?
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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Hare View Post
    900 billion off? No wonder no one wants to give more money to this administration, their math seems a little fuzzy.
    I wonder how far off they are on the unemployment numbers?
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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    CBO | Another Comment on CBO

    Another Comment on CBO’s Estimates for the Insurance Coverage Provisions of the Affordable Care Act




    March 16, 2012
    CBO released two reports this week related to the analysis of the Affordable Care Act (ACA) conducted by CBO and the staff of the Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT). One report presented updated estimates for the insurance coverage provisions of the ACA, and the other responded to questions we’ve received regarding the effects of the ACA on employment-based health insurance.
    Some of the commentary on those reports has suggested that CBO and JCT have changed their estimates of the effects of the ACA to a significant degree. That’s not our perspective.
    Assessing the impact of broad changes in the nation’s health insurance system, like those in the ACA, requires assumptions and projections about a wide array of technical, behavioral, and economic factors. CBO and JCT, in consultation with outside experts, have devoted a great deal of care and effort to analyzing health care legislation in the past few years—but our estimates are still very uncertain. We will continue to update our estimates regarding health insurance coverage as new information becomes available about the implementation of the ACA, underlying trends in the health care and health financing systems, and the probable responses to the legislation by businesses, families, and others. In addition, we are continually trying to improve our modeling techniques and estimating procedures.
    It is certainly possible that—at some point—new legislation, new information, and new models or estimating procedures will lead us to make significant changes to our estimates of the effects of the ACA. So far, however, that has occurred for only one significant provision of the ACA—the CLASS long-term care insurance program, which the Administration has concluded it cannot implement. (For more information on that topic, see this letter.)
    For the provisions of the Affordable Care Act related to health insurance coverage, CBO and JCT’s latest estimates are quite similar to the estimates we released when the legislation was being considered in March 2010. The following figure shows CBO and JCT’s projections of the effects of the ACA on the number of people who will be uninsured or will receive insurance coverage through employer-sponsored insurance (ESI), insurance exchanges, or Medicaid or the Children’s Health Insurance Program (CHIP). Although the latest projections extend the original ones by three years (corresponding to the shift in the regular 10-year projection period since the ACA was first being developed), the projections for each given year have changed little, on net, since March 2010.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkles View Post
    And every country that has plunged into a socialist 3rd world ruins, has always used the exact same justification for their own destruction. Only government can provide clean water, and for 50 years the majority of Indians didn't have access to clean water. Now they have a capitalist system in place, and clean water is being provided throughout the country, not completely, but a higher percentage than ever before.

    So here we are with the same justification. Only government can fix health care. Really? You realize that health care is already the 3rd most highly regulated sector in the US?

    Remember how Airlines were highly regulated prior to the 1970s? What happened after deregulation? Cheaper airfare, and more access to air travel to more people, than ever before. Now commuter jets are filled, instead of running half empty with government subsidies. (except in political pork districts which still get subsidized air travel).

    Funny how deregulation didn't ruin the airline industry. Funny how the lack of regulation doesn't ruin 99% of the products in our stores.

    Yet in this case, in an industry already highly regulated, we have huge problems. And yet your claim is, only more regulation and intervention can fix those problems.

    Well I disagree. I think the regulation we have are the direct cause of our problems. More regulation has never fixed anything, will only make things worse.

    Look at India. They have a massive socialized care system, and it's junk. But then they have these private pay-for-service hospitals, that people all over the world are flying there to get to. Why? What are they doing differently that is draw people all over the world?

    They don't have government control. Same in Singapore. Dozens of government run hospital, and only the private non-government-controlled hospitals are attracting people from all over the world.

    I would dare you to give one district in one state, complete exemption from all government regulations. No medicare, no medicaid, no rules, no regulations. And lets see what happens. I would bet you anything, the price of care at those hospitals and clinics would drop like a rock. They would have more services, and lower costs, in a matter of months.
    Hoes many times gas the air line industry been bailed out since then? Also, part of the reason why the gov gas to get involved is because of hoe involved they already are by repealing laws and passing others (allowing insurance to be did across state lines for instance). I for one think one of the good things to come out of Congress care is the removal life term caps. This forces the insurance company to honor its contact by not kicking people of the rolls once they get sick, thus screwing them for life.

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    Re: CBO: Obamacare to cost $1.76 Trillion over 10 years

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    elaborate? what country has plunged into 3rd world ruins due to socialism or social programs?
    For under $100 per month per family, Canadians have adequate health care. Are they 3rd world? How about the many countries in Europe that provide health care and other social needs?
    Greece? C'mon make the questions harder.

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