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Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

nota bene said:
I haven't forgotten anything; in fact, I haven't commented at all on allies that have become enemies and am not quite sure to which enemies you refer. I simply asked a question: Isn't the reason this is new because the Admin may have extended a carrot to Israel in exchange for Israel's not acting against Iran?
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I doubt that the current administration would offer weapons to Israel in exchange for not striking. BO has been very muslim friendly and would not do anything to improve Israels ability to act militarily in the region. Unless forced by public opinion, and according to his Defence Secretary, given permission by the international community, he would probably not support Israel. I have not seen any evidence that he is willing to offer Israel a carrot to go along with the stick of withholding aide.

jamesrage--I completely understand your point, but do not agree with it in this case. Yes, Iran turned on us, Castro turned on us, the Sandanista's turned on us, the Mujahideen turned on us. Throughout the cold war, we supported dictators and oppressive regimes in many places inorder to gain basing and listening support against the Soviet Union. In Afghanistan, we supported the muslims against the Soviet Union. The problem with this was that we were supporting dictators and regimes that were fundamentally opposed to the Philosophies of Human Rights and fundamental freedoms that the US is supposed to Champion. Throughout the world, we have very few real allies, I would rate Israel, Britain, the British Commonwealth Nations (Canada, Australia, etc) and Japan as true Allies, the rest are allies of convinience that have and will in the future act against our interests. Japan, though a true ally, in my opinion, is not really a military ally, they show no interest in militarization or acting militarily outside their own borders and even monetarily support US forces as part of their national defence plan. Israel has not acted against our interests, they may not always support a sitting administrations policies, and I do not believe that they would act against us in the future unless we acted against them first. All the historical evidence points to Israel just trying to survive and that what they really want is to just be left alone and allowed to exist and conduct trade. We should support our friends and allies, but we also need to be sure that they really are friends and allies first, not doing so has bitten us on tha ass to many times. Israel is one friend and ally that I am sure of.
 
Misterveritis said:
In your opinion is Iran going slow now?
Which country's "leader" has stated his goal is the destruction of Israel?
We should be providing every possible sort of support to Israel and the Iranian people. They are the country that needs to be fundamentally transformed, not ours.
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The wipe Israel off the map thing has been debunked.

('Wiped off the Map' – The Rumor of the Century - by Arash Norouzi) (Lost in translation | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk) (Just How Far Did They Go, Those Words Against Israel? - NYTimes.com) (Sam Sedaei: The Biggest Lie Told To The American People: Ahmadinejad's Alleged Remarks On Israel)
 
Israel is more than capable of manufacturing of weapons capable of destroying hardened targets domestically. The Israeli offer should be refused as it needlessly mires the U.S. government deeper in the conflict and brings zero advantages.
 
jamesrage said:
We shouldn't give or sell weapons to other countries regardless if they are friend or foe. If history has taught us anything is that allies can turn into enemies and I would rather not give or sell something that can used against us or our troops in the future.
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Great Britain would have been in a world of hurt had the US not provided the lend-lease program at the start of WWII. I think the problem the US has encountered mostly has been providing weapons or related financial support to the "if you're the enemy of my enemy then your my friend" crowd. OBL crowd comes to mind, as well as Saddam Hussein.

I personally have no problem with the US helping established allies defend themselves. I would hope they would do the same for us if the opportunity ever arose.
 
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In my opinion I think its a great idea if Israel gets this bunker buster!

hope they get it! fingers crossed ;)
 
Bunker Busters will be delivered to Israel only after the elections so as not to undermine Obama's promising 2nd term of office.
 
Mr. Invisible said:
The wipe Israel off the map thing has been debunked.

('Wiped off the Map' – The Rumor of the Century - by Arash Norouzi) (Lost in translation | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk) (Just How Far Did They Go, Those Words Against Israel? - NYTimes.com) (Sam Sedaei: The Biggest Lie Told To The American People: Ahmadinejad's Alleged Remarks On Israel)
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On the contrary. What do you take it to mean if the translation says the occupying regime must be obliterated? That is confirmation. It is not debunking. Have you become an islamist shill?
 
Misterveritis said:
On the contrary. What do you take it to mean if the translation says the occupying regime must be obliterated? That is confirmation. It is not debunking. Have you become an islamist shill?
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hmm...who wants to wipe who off the map?

who is the one ranting and raving about how evil the other one is, and how they must be attacked, or the Holocaust will happen again?
 
Misterveritis said:
On the contrary. What do you take it to mean if the translation says the occupying regime must be obliterated? That is confirmation. It is not debunking. Have you become an islamist shill?
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actually, it is the israeli shills who refuse to acknowledge the iranian president's remarks advocated removal of the current israeli reich wing government as regime change and not obliteration of the nation itself
but being without a sound argument why a nation that refuses to sign the NPT should receive a larger bomb to drop on a nation which is a NPT signatory, such fabrication is needed to justify the warlike intentions of israel. iran has not initiated an attack on a sovereign nation in 200 years while it has not been 200 weeks since israel has done so. and meanwhile, israel is rattling its sabers and driving up oil speculation (to the tune of 56 cents per gallon), thus hurting the chances for an economic recovery in the USA
bibi would love nothing more than to achieve regime chane in the states, by undermining the Obama economic recovery so that a republican president willing to be subordinate to israeli interests can be elected

putin is on the sidelines observing:
Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin on Friday accused the West of attempting to institute "regime change" in Iran as it mulls possible military action over Tehran's controversial nuclear programme.

"Under the guise of trying to prevent the spread of weapons of mass destruction... they are attempting something else entirely and setting different goals -- regime change," news agencies quoted Putin as saying
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Putin says West seeking 'regime change' in Iran - FRANCE 24

so, iran seeks israeli regime change, while israel seeks USA regime change, while israel and the USA seek israeli regime change
and in the west, the only hue and cry is to misrepresent the regime change iran is seeking, as something more; something to mobilize the reich wing base to mobilize against iran. it does not matter that it consists of propaganda. the lemmings will not look for themselves to see what was actually said
 
Thunder said:
hmm...who wants to wipe who off the map?
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Iran has been ranting and raving. Obviously so. Rafsangani laid out the rationale for why they seek the nukes several years ago, the regime of Iran holds Holocaust denial conferences, they are genocidal antisemites looking to establish a world wide caliphate, and any person who is not delusional recognizes what they are all about.
 
Gardener said:
or anything else that isn't spoon fed to you at the Islamist hate sites you use to form your world view.
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Misterveritis said:
On the contrary. What do you take it to mean if the translation says the occupying regime must be obliterated? That is confirmation. It is not debunking. Have you become an islamist shill?
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wow, so if someone disagrees..they get accused of being an "Islamist shill" or of frequenting "Islamist hate sites".

wow. so much for honest & intelligent debate.
 
Thunder said:
wow, so if someone disagrees..they get accused of being an "Islamist shill" or of frequenting "Islamist hate sites".

wow. so much for honest & intelligent debate.
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Actually, the poster in question DOES promote Islamist hate sites -- most recently am Islamist terrorist support/antisemitic hate site site called aljazeerah.info (not to be confused with the other aljazeera).
 
Gardener said:
Actually, the poster in question DOES promote Islamist hate sites -- most recently am Islamist terrorist support/antisemitic hate site site called aljazeerah.info (not to be confused with the other aljazeera).
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does he promote it, or merely sourced it?

there is a difference.
 
Thunder said:
does he promote it, or merely sourced it?

there is a difference.
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Alexa claims to be a she.

Linking to hate sites is an act of promotion since it encourages posters to frequent them.
 
DVSentinel said:
A Nuclear armed Iran is a threat to Israel. Iran continues support terrorist acting against Israel. So give Israel the bunker busters, heck, send them a squadron of F-117 Stealth Fighters and a few B-2 Stealth Bombers along with them. Israel is not a threat to US security and interests, Iran is.
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The F-117 is not a fighter, it has absolutely not fighting capabilities, it is strictly a bomber. And it is a bomber that we have retired, or are in the process of retiring so I don't think Israel wants those.
 
Thunder said:
hmm...who wants to wipe who off the map?

who is the one ranting and raving about how evil the other one is, and how they must be attacked, or the Holocaust will happen again?
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You again? I just shake my head.
 
justabubba said:
actually, it is the israeli shills who refuse to acknowledge the iranian president's remarks advocated removal of the current israeli reich wing government as regime change and not obliteration of the nation itself
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Okay. So you anti-Israel. And perhaps pro-Iran. Do you also apologize for the Iranian involvement with the terrorism against Israelis? I shall not be surprised if you do.

but being without a sound argument why a nation that refuses to sign the NPT should receive a larger bomb to drop on a nation which is a NPT signatory, such fabrication is needed to justify the warlike intentions of israel.
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It sounds like Israel intends to destroy deep underground facilities. I stand with Israel.

iran has not initiated an attack on a sovereign nation in 200 years while it has not been 200 weeks since israel has done so.
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That is a great talking point. Was Iraq something other than a sovereign nation? Those two fought back and forth for years. Wait. Don't tell me. In your opinion Iran was completely blameless.

and meanwhile, israel is rattling its sabers and driving up oil speculation (to the tune of 56 cents per gallon), thus hurting the chances for an economic recovery in the USA
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Wait! Don't tell me. The one term Marxist president Barack Hussein Obama's idiotic policies have had no effect on oil. Am I right? Isn't that what you want to say? When the one term Marxist illegally imposes a shutdown of drilling in the gulf that has no impact? When the one term Marxist says his policies will cause energy costs to necessarily skyrocket will you argue that his policies have had no effect?

bibi would love nothing more than to achieve regime chane in the states, by undermining the Obama economic recovery so that a republican president willing to be subordinate to israeli interests can be elected
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If so he is on the right side of this issue. I stand with Israel on the need for regime change in this nation.
 
Thunder said:
wow, so if someone disagrees..they get accused of being an "Islamist shill" or of frequenting "Islamist hate sites".

wow. so much for honest & intelligent debate.
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Do you disagree? The occupying regime must be obliterated. Nice turn of phrase. Clearly that is intended to show a peaceful resolution to their differences...if you are an Islamist shill.
 
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