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Thread: Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

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    Re: Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    We shouldn't give or sell weapons to other countries regardless if they are friend or foe. If history has taught us anything is that allies can turn into enemies and I would rather not give or sell something that can used against us or our troops in the future.
    True, but I think Israel is a safe bet as a long-term ally especially if Obama gets beaten in November. Anyway, far better to fight by proxy and Israel might be willing to take out Iran's weapons in their own self interest.

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    Re: Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

    Quote Originally Posted by Meathead View Post
    it certainly would be tedious constantly explaining the obvious to the obtuse,
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    Re: Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

    Quote Originally Posted by DVSentinel View Post
    So Iran has not backed terriorist that have attacked Israel many times in the past? Iran didn't send fighters to Bosnia-Herzegovina to fight for the muslims there? Iran didn't fund and supply insurgents in Iraq? Iran wasn't sending support for Shiite muslims in UAE and other areas in the mideast to stir up protests? Iran has not repeatedly called for the distruction of the state of Israel?

    And when has Israel ever launched a war of aggression? Current operations and many in the past is in response to Palistinians (some funded and supplied by Iran) launched rockets against civilian targets in Israel. Modern Israel came about because the British controlled the area and refugees from anti-jewish areas fled there. The British had control of the area following crusades and the fall of the Ottoman empire, seeking to free the Holy Lands from muslim control. The British were trying to limit the influx and reduce conflict between the Palistinians and the Jews. However, their Mandate failed and the British chose to pull out. The plan was for a Jewish state, and Arab state and international control of Jerusalem. The UN and the Jewish community accepted this plan of Partition with Economic Union, however, the Arabs did not. The Jewish Agency declared independence the day prior to the expiration of the British Mandate, renaming the country Israel and four Arab countries attacked them. This is the first war between Israel and the Arabs, the Arabs were the agressors, not Israel. Following this war, Jordan controlled the west bank and Jerusalem and Ebypt controlled the Gaza strip and Irael controlled the lands that had been the Jewish area under the British. In 1967, Egypt expelled UN peacekeepers from the Sinai Peninsula and attempted to blockade Israels access to the Red Sea. Several Arab Nations formed a coalition and postitioned troops intending to attack Israel, however, Israel launched a suprise attack and defeated these forces and countries taking control of the West Bank, The Gaza Strip, Golan Heights, Sinai Peninsula and Jerusalem. Again, the Arabs were the aggressors, not Israel. In 1973, Egypt and Syria again attacked Israel but were repelled. Once again, the Arabs were the aggressors, not Israel. In 1981, Israel did stike nuclear facilities in Iraq, this could be considered aggression, however, Iraq was supporting terriorist attacking Israel and Israeli citizens. The Israelis have invaded southern Lebenon a couple of times in response to attacks by PLO and Hama terrorist.

    The Palestinians have been given chances for peace and self government. Israel gave them limited self-rule in the 1990s, but the Palestinians have elected known terrorist for their government. When the PLO refused to continue operations against Israel and instead attempted to keep the peace, the Palestinians turned to the more agressive Hamas factions. Since then, Hamas has repeatedly sent rockets into Israel against civilian targets and has supported/initiated many terrerist attacks against Israel.

    So in all this, where is this war that Israel initiated? Israel has always responded to provocation. Their control of the contested regions stems from the Arabs attacking them not the other way around. The Palestinians were part of the countries that started wars with Israel and they lost. If you start a war and lose, you can expect to have to live with the results, including the victor taking lands. There are Palestinians in Israel who do not support terrorist and are just as prosperous and peaceful as any other Israeli citizen. If the peoples of the "occupied" areas would act the same, they would have better prosperity and living conditions also. But instead, they lauch rockets at civilians and then whine when Israel responds to those attacks.

    A Nuclear armed Iran is a threat to Israel. Iran continues support terrorist acting against Israel. So give Israel the bunker busters, heck, send them a squadron of F-117 Stealth Fighters and a few B-2 Stealth Bombers along with them. Israel is not a threat to US security and interests, Iran is.
    Israel at war with Iran is a threat to the entire area and US interests. There is also no evidence that bunker busters or any other air attack would eliminate the ability of Iran to produce nuclear weapons. It would however garantee that Iran would move as fast as possible with it as a result.

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    Re: Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

    Quote Originally Posted by Meathead View Post
    True, but I think Israel is a safe bet as a long-term ally especially if Obama gets beaten in November. Anyway, far better to fight by proxy and Israel might be willing to take out Iran's weapons in their own self interest.
    Obama get beaten? You ARE out of touch. Their is no "proxy" we will be at war if Israel uses our weapons.

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    Re: Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

    Israel wants us to give them a bunkerbuster?


    change the word "give" to "sell" and I don't really care.

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    Re: Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Obama get beaten? You ARE out of touch. Their is no "proxy" we will be at war if Israel uses our weapons.
    Your certainty is certainly more than a bit knee-jerky on both counts. I know, it's a liberal thing.

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    Re: Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Obama get beaten? You ARE out of touch. Their is no "proxy" we will be at war if Israel uses our weapons.
    Hmm... it wasn't that way in Libya, and yes it was a totally different situation and circumstance.... I'm just saying I don't think it's that black & white.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Hmm... it wasn't that way in Libya, and yes it was a totally different situation and circumstance.... I'm just saying I don't think it's that black & white.
    Of course it was the same. You don't think Gadaffi felt that the US was at war with him? How dumb do you think he was?
    It is just that we didn't care in Libya. Iran can put the whole Western world in lot of hurt, just by closing the Straights.
    And for what for? Another goose hunt for WMD's? Pakistan has them by the dozen, how safe is that?
    Last edited by iguanaman; 03-11-12 at 04:28 PM.

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    Re: Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Of course it was the same. You don't think Gadaffi felt that the US was at war with him? How dumb do you think he was?
    So you're worried what the Iranian government thinks? Most report that Iran thinks they are at war with the U.S. already. What Gadaffi thinks? Irrelevant then and now since he's worm food.

    So am I to understand you're not buying Obama's position that the U.S. wasn't militarily involved in Libya?

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    It is just that we didn't care in Libya. Iran can put the whole Western world in lot of hurt, just by closing the Straights.
    And for what for? Another goose hunt for WMD's? Pakistan has them by the dozen, how safe is that?
    So far safe enough - at least the Israeli's aren't worried about Pakistan launching missiles into Israel to kill all the joos. Not so with Iran, probably due to geographic proximity, intelligence, and the amount of moronic rhetoric coming from Iran in the past decade. And goose hunt? Nah... that's not it at all. It's a seek and destroy mission. Israel doesn't want to show the world their actions are justified, they could care less what others think is or is not justified. They'll just destroy what they see is a threat to their existence. Much easier; cleaner.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: Israel Asks for Bunker Buster

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    We shouldn't give or sell weapons to other countries regardless if they are friend or foe. If history has taught us anything is that allies can turn into enemies and I would rather not give or sell something that can used against us or our troops in the future.
    I'm gonna have to disagree with you. We have been sharing weapons with Israel for 50+ years without such repercussions.

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