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Thread: Over 90% of the income gains in the first year of the recovery went to the top 1%

  1. #181
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    Re: Over 90% of the income gains in the first year of the recovery went to the top 1%

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhapsody1447 View Post
    You're a business owner with a computer and high speed internet and you're complaining about opportunity in this country? Look around the world, you're the freaking 1% dude.
    and he has better health care then the richest person in the world could of obtained 20 years ago.

    but wealth does not trickle down.

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    Re: Over 90% of the income gains in the first year of the recovery went to the top 1%

    Quote Originally Posted by JP Hochbaum View Post
    This argument isn't about the rest of the world.
    I see, it's the top 1% fighting to be the top 0.1%. You lament the systematic suppression of opportunity in one post and claim you own a consulting business in another. When comparisons are drawn between opportunities in our system to others around the world, you dismiss them off-hand. Opportunity and ability, by definition, are never universally shared. Inequality of opportunity is inherent in human society, people reap the benefits sown by their ancestors before them. Just as us Americans reap the benefits sown by the work of our countrymen before us. There is nothing immoral about contributing to the success of your offspring. In fact, it’s natural and moral to do so. The benefits you reap from the financial and social success of your parents is no morally different than the benefits you receive from them nurturing and raising you as a child. The only immoral inequities of opportunity are those that are systematic in government through legislation and coercion.
    "There is an excellent correlation between giving society what it wants and making money, and almost no correlation between the desire to make money and how much money one makes." ~Dalio

  3. #183
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    Re: Over 90% of the income gains in the first year of the recovery went to the top 1%

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    and he has better health care then the richest person in the world could of obtained 20 years ago.
    Only for those that can afford it, that's the problem. We have the most expensive health care system in the world.

    but wealth does not trickle down.
    The middle class wages has stagnated during the last 30 years while those at the top have quadrupled in income. And the rich folk are investing their tax cuts in jobs overseas. What's the incentive again for the middle class to continue voting for tax cuts for the rich?
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  4. #184
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    Re: Over 90% of the income gains in the first year of the recovery went to the top 1%

    The middle class has not "stagnated" in the last 30 years - given that that would put this measure starting at 1982; quite the opposite. A large number of the "middle class" have moved into the upper income brackets. Incomes have continued to go up, as have living standards. omg but the cost of living!!!; yes, the basket of goods now includes an extra car, a bigger house, a home computer, etc. and so forth. surprise, it costs more to purchase 2 cars in 2012 than it did to purchase 1 car in 1982, and it costs more to purchase a computer in 2012 than it cost not to purchase a computer in 1982.

    What has happened is that household income has been incredibly damaged and those raises mitigated by the rise in divorce and single-parent families over that time period. American society is bifurcating into those classes that get and stay married and do well, and those that do not, and do poorly. In addition, the rising cost of healthcare has eaten much of the remaining increase in compensation - moving away from a third-party-payment system has been demonstrated repeatedly to solve that problem, and can be instituted at a national level with relatively little effort.

    As for the middle class incentive - the tax burden on the middle class has been lightened relative to the upper income earners over the same time period. It turns out (shocker) that when you allow people who are by definition more productive more freedom with their resources... they are even more productive, and you can tax that productivity . I'm also unaware of any tax cut for the "rich" (that is an excellent point, Rhapsody - everyone in this thread is in the top 1%) that hasn't simply been part of a package that included rate cuts for everyone. what you are actually asking the middle class to do is use our superior numbers to begin screwing over someone else in order to benefit themselves; and so the answer to your question is "because we are better than that."
    Last edited by cpwill; 03-16-12 at 08:25 PM.

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    Re: Over 90% of the income gains in the first year of the recovery went to the top 1%

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    The middle class has not "stagnated" in the last 30 years - given that that would put this measure starting at 1982; quite the opposite. A large number of the "middle class" have moved into the upper income brackets. Incomes have continued to go up, as have living standards. omg but the cost of living!!!; yes, the basket of goods now includes an extra car, a bigger house, a home computer, etc. and so forth. surprise, it costs more to purchase 2 cars in 2012 than it did to purchase 1 car in 1982, and it costs more to purchase a computer in 2012 than it cost not to purchase a computer in 1982.

    What has happened is that household income has been incredibly damaged and those raises mitigated by the rise in divorce and single-parent families over that time period. American society is bifurcating into those classes that get and stay married and do well, and those that do not, and do poorly. In addition, the rising cost of healthcare has eaten much of the remaining increase in compensation - moving away from a third-party-payment system has been demonstrated repeatedly to solve that problem, and can be instituted at a national level with relatively little effort.

    As for the middle class incentive - the tax burden on the middle class has been lightened relative to the upper income earners over the same time period. It turns out (shocker) that when you allow people who are by definition more productive more freedom with their resources... they are even more productive, and you can tax that productivity . I'm also unaware of any tax cut for the "rich" (that is an excellent point, Rhapsody - everyone in this thread is in the top 1%) that hasn't simply been part of a package that included rate cuts for everyone. what you are actually asking the middle class to do is use our superior numbers to begin screwing over someone else in order to benefit themselves; and so the answer to your question is "because we are better than that."

    Thanks for you opinion!

    However, the facts show:

    "Incomes for 90% of Americans have been stuck in neutral, and it's not just because of the Great Recession. Middle-class incomes have been stagnant for at least a generation, while the wealthiest tier has surged ahead at lighting speed.

    In 1988, the income of an average American taxpayer was $33,400, adjusted for inflation. Fast forward 20 years, and not much had changed: The average income was still just $33,000 in 2008, according to IRS data.

    Meanwhile, the richest 1% of Americans -- those making $380,000 or more -- have seen their incomes grow 33% over the last 20 years, leaving average Americans in the dust. (How the rich became the über rich)"

    How the middle class became the underclass - Feb. 16, 2011

    "Tax Cuts For Wealthy Americans Cost Treasury $11.6 Million Every Hour"

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/1...n_1011601.html


    Sorry, but there is no incentive for the working class to continue voting for tax cuts for the rich. If a dog bites you once, its his fault. If the dog bites you twice, its your fault.
    Last edited by Catawba; 03-16-12 at 08:56 PM.
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  6. #186
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    Re: Over 90% of the income gains in the first year of the recovery went to the top 1%

    Quote Originally Posted by JP Hochbaum View Post
    I didn't say it was easy. Your interpretation of things are more simple, and really aren't based in reality.

    The people that are jobless right now aren't jobless by choice, you seem to think this is the case. THere are currently 8 people unemployed per job opening.
    In a word you are 'wrong'. We work with people EVERY DAY. Its not EASY...Eminently DOABLE. You have to be willing to DO it...not whine about how unfair life is. Things dont change overnight...they do change over a course of time with an effective plan and hard work. Or...they can just believe people like you, roll over and expect to be taken care of. Thats really not a problem...Those that act as you suggest simply continue to make it easier for those willing to do what it takes. Good thing those MILLIONS of illegal and otherwise immigrants pouring in here every year dont share your fatalistic vision...right? Funny how they manage to find all those jobs you claim no one can get.

  7. #187
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    Re: Over 90% of the income gains in the first year of the recovery went to the top 1%

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Only for those that can afford it, that's the problem. We have the most expensive health care system in the world.



    The middle class wages has stagnated during the last 30 years while those at the top have quadrupled in income. And the rich folk are investing their tax cuts in jobs overseas. What's the incentive again for the middle class to continue voting for tax cuts for the rich?
    smart rich people invest their money where they either make the best return or the money is safest

  8. #188
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    Re: Over 90% of the income gains in the first year of the recovery went to the top 1%

    Quote Originally Posted by JP Hochbaum View Post

    The people that are jobless right now aren't jobless by choice, you seem to think this is the case. THere are currently 8 people unemployed per job opening.

    It seems most conservatives do not understand this, or they simply ignore it to adhere to the GOP talking points,
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Over 90% of the income gains in the first year of the recovery went to the top 1%

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    It seems most conservatives do not understand this, or they simply ignore it to adhere to the GOP talking points,
    so whose fault is this?

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    Re: Over 90% of the income gains in the first year of the recovery went to the top 1%

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    smart rich people invest their money where they either make the best return or the money is safest
    The working class has no interest in continuing to vote for tax cuts to the rich that they just use to invest overseas. The debt has grown too large and the economy has suffered too much, and they are not helping the working class.

    Tax cuts to those that actually produce jobs in this country make sense. Voting to give someone a tax cut just because they are rich is idiotic!
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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