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Thread: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

  1. #81
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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by OpportunityCost View Post
    Thats kind of what Newt is saying but he used partisan buzzwords and tripped the bull**** meters. He is saying that government service and structures need a change in mindset, governments current purpose seems to be to create more work for itself, from congress and the executive branch on down. That needs to change and it cannot be done with the same people in place that seem to keep moving the government engine forward onto bigger and bigger bureaucracy.

    Newt overthought this and worded it terribly. But if we are going to change the philosophy of government and exact real change, people need to change their thinking or hit the road. Im not even talking liberal and conservative here but the nature and scope of government.
    well, i will let newt speak for himself and what he says cannot be explained away
    he appears to want to fire career civil servants who are not of his own political inclination
    a stupid, stupid suggestion

    what you have offered in an effort to explain away newt's foolish remarks actually exists
    when the executive is elected into office, the president appoints the staff who will head the various agencies of government
    that which was emphasized in a previous administration may now be de-emphasized in favor of another direction in which those appointees have pointed for their subordinates to follow as they perform the government's works
    while they cannot direct the career civil service employees to violate any laws, rules or regulations they can and do direct them to focus their energies in a particular direction as decided by the executive office
    these political appointees can also shape government direction by allocating their budgets such that the most funding flows in the direction of initiatives favored by the president and his advisors

    those career rank and file employees who received their jobs based on merit rather than political affiliation are the ones who must heed the directives they are given by the political appointees and carry out the government's work
    these career employees must execute the requirements imposed upon them by their supervisors even if doing so is in contradiction with their own political views
    as a personal example, when i was hired into the federal service i was a capital "L" Libertarian, opposed to government intervention which was not in keeping with the invisible hand that libertarians are so fond of. and one of my first jobs was to decide which small businesses would receive government/taxpayer provided money to start or expand their businesses
    my personal political views (since revised) had to subordinated to the task i was assigned to perform. clearly, i could not refuse to make government loans to all small business applicants, while my personal political persuasion would have dictated such inaction

    and coming out of a long career spent in government and as a k street lobbyist, newt knows these things. this is yet another dog whistle he directs at those who are not so informed
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by OpportunityCost View Post
    Thats kind of what Newt is saying but he used partisan buzzwords and tripped the bull**** meters. He is saying that government service and structures need a change in mindset, governments current purpose seems to be to create more work for itself, from congress and the executive branch on down. That needs to change and it cannot be done with the same people in place that seem to keep moving the government engine forward onto bigger and bigger bureaucracy.

    Newt overthought this and worded it terribly. But if we are going to change the philosophy of government and exact real change, people need to change their thinking or hit the road. Im not even talking liberal and conservative here but the nature and scope of government.
    The line "need a change in mindset" is spot on. It goes down to local as well.

    I have a sister who over the last yrs has gotten involved in her local township govt. At the end of 2009 they instituted a 3 yr "pay freeze". After some digging citizens found out that in 2010 out of 34 employees 7 received between 7 & 14% pay increases. 2011 saw another 9 get raises between 5 & 12%. 2012 there are raises scheduled for another 11. The rationale is that they are under contract and the contract calls for these "time in service" raises. I can't argue with that point if that's the agreed contract so be it. 27 out of 34 people get raises. That's a govt employees idea of a "pay freeze". I sometimes think they live in a different universe than the rest of us.

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    In other news, the White House claims that Newt Gingrich suggested that ground puppy-burgers be fed to elementary school children and the elderly.
    Downplay the right wing's idiocy at your peril.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by gingern44 View Post
    The line "need a change in mindset" is spot on. It goes down to local as well.

    I have a sister who over the last yrs has gotten involved in her local township govt. At the end of 2009 they instituted a 3 yr "pay freeze". After some digging citizens found out that in 2010 out of 34 employees 7 received between 7 & 14% pay increases. 2011 saw another 9 get raises between 5 & 12%. 2012 there are raises scheduled for another 11. The rationale is that they are under contract and the contract calls for these "time in service" raises. I can't argue with that point if that's the agreed contract so be it. 27 out of 34 people get raises. That's a govt employees idea of a "pay freeze". I sometimes think they live in a different universe than the rest of us.
    No, they live in a universe where contracts must be honored.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    No, they live in a universe where contracts must be honored.
    I have no problem with that. But don't try to tell me how much they're "sacrificing" with their "pay freeze".

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by gingern44 View Post
    I have no problem with that. But don't try to tell me how much they're "sacrificing" with their "pay freeze".
    I doubt anyone told you that. You just didn't look at the details.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    [QUOTE=misterman;1060180830]
    And then he said the rebels were wrong, and uneducated, and needed to fail.
    I'll accept that in regards to the specific rebellion he was speaking of. It doesn't seem to me he's speaking to all dissent and all future uprisings.

    I don't, because I think HE would have morphed alot in 220 years too.
    I believe anyone credited with the following would not be pleased with the our present state. "democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not".

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by gingern44 View Post
    I'll accept that in regards to the specific rebellion he was speaking of. It doesn't seem to me he's speaking to all dissent and all future uprisings.
    He VERY CLEARLY meant all future uprisings! He was talking about the future!

    I believe anyone credited with the following would not be pleased with the our present state. "democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not".
    Jefferson never said that though. It has never been found in any of his writings.

    The democracy will cease to exist... (Quotation) « Thomas Jefferson

    He did say similar things though.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    No, they live in a universe where contracts must be honored.
    Unless they are first lien bondholders with Chrysler of course.

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    He VERY CLEARLY meant all future uprisings! He was talking about the future!
    I'm not seeing the "clearly meant all future..."


    Jefferson never said that though. It has never been found in any of his writings
    .

    The democracy will cease to exist... (Quotation) « Thomas Jefferson

    He did say similar things though.[/QUOTE]

    I kinda like this better anyway much more eloquent, "To take from one, because it is thought that his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, -€˜the guarantee to every one of a free exercise of his industry, & the fruits acquired by it.'"[3]

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