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Thread: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

  1. #91
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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    I doubt anyone told you that. You just didn't look at the details.
    Actually it was the main selling point to a local levy on the ballot last fall. Govt employees already sacrificed now it's everyone else's turn.
    I hear from a lot of govt employees complaining about having to pickup more of their healthcare costs. When I inform them that the increases they have experienced recently
    have almost caught them up to where I was 15yrs ago they don't want to hear it. They feel they are "entitled" to lower costs than the rest of us. After all they're the govt.

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by gingern44 View Post
    I'm not seeing the "clearly meant all future..."
    Seriously? He's talking about what might happen in the future. It couldn't be more clear.

    The quote is not found in any of his writings. Just because someone says he said it doesn't mean he did. Lots of errors and fake quotes are out there.

    I kinda like this better anyway much more eloquent, "To take from one, because it is thought that his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, -€˜the guarantee to every one of a free exercise of his industry, & the fruits acquired by it.'"[3]
    I like it better because it's actually a documented quote and not a fabrication.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by gingern44 View Post
    Actually it was the main selling point to a local levy on the ballot last fall.
    And were there details offered?

    I hear from a lot of govt employees complaining about having to pickup more of their healthcare costs. When I inform them that the increases they have experienced recently
    have almost caught them up to where I was 15yrs ago they don't want to hear it. They feel they are "entitled" to lower costs than the rest of us. After all they're the govt.
    No, they complained because they are losing something. Did you complain 15 years ago? You should have. Maybe you're a wimp who can' stand up for yourself. Maybe the private sector is getting screwed, and now government workers are. Why would you be so eager to make everyone as worse off as you are? It's astounding what the right wing has done with this argument - they screw private workers over, and instead of private workers saying they ought to get it back, they say they want government workers to suffer too. So everyone will be poor and without benefits - great!
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    And were there details offered?
    On a political commercial? 3 second blurbs. You're missing the point, the citizens had to dig the information out of them. The govt was more than happy to stick with the "pay freeze" picture.

    No, they complained because they are losing something. Why would you be so eager to make everyone as worse off as you are? It's astounding what the right wing has done with this argument - they screw private workers over, and instead of private workers saying they ought to get it back, they say they want government workers to suffer too. So everyone will be poor and without benefits - great!
    Losing something? If that's not the perfect entitlement mentality. The cost of your familys healthcare has been rising 6-12% a year and after a decade or 2 of those increases you have to go from paying 15% of your healthcare costs to paying 25%. Oh the poor dears. Tell me, when those costs rose year after year did you consider those increased costs to be increased compensation? I'm betting not. After all they're entitled to it. I wonder if the increased costs of healthcare in anyway impacted the govt scheduled pay raises. I'm betting not.

    Did you complain 15 years ago? You should have. Maybe you're a wimp who can' stand up for yourself. Maybe the private sector is getting screwed, and now government workers are.
    I couldn't stand up for myself, I would have had to stand up to myself. It was my company. And yes, my costs went up right along with everyone else.

    Why would you be so eager to make everyone as worse off as you are?
    I tend to look at it as paying your fair share. I owned the company and I can assure you my benefits never came close to those of my best friend whose been working for a state university for about the same time frame. His HC was far superior to mine and for 20 of the last 25 yrs he paid virtually nothing. I along with my employees paid his healthcare. How about time off? He gets more time off in 1 year than I did in a decade or my employees took in a 5yrs. As a matter of fact he's about to go N Orleans to an annual conference. I'll be getting a call from Bourbon St in a couple of weeks to rub it in. Oh, by the way, I and my employees pay for that too.

    Why would you be so eager to make everyone as worse off as you are?
    As worse off as I am? How about standing up and help pay for your own healthcare? The private sector has been providing the public sector with cadilac benefits forever, while I and my employees pay twice as much and get cavaliers.

    It's astounding what the right wing has done with this argument - they screw private workers over, and instead of private workers saying they ought to get it back, they say they want government workers to suffer too. So everyone will be poor and without benefits - great!
    First I'm hardly right wing. And how in the world the world has the right wing screwed private sector workers? The left sees this all through the prism of Wall St investment bankers and GM. Most people work for small businesses and small business is not sitting on the oft sited 2 Trillion that the left says business is sitting on. They're trying to survive. Private sector workers have figured out that their employer is not necessarily the enemy. In a small business it's very easy to sit folks down and say guys "I just can't cover HC as I did before", and show them the numbers. People get it. Unfortunately for the left I also made a point to mention what their public counterparts were paying and the fact we were all paying for it. It astounds me that public employees receive better benefits than 99% of the private sector and all they do is complain about it.

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by gingern44 View Post
    On a political commercial? 3 second blurbs. You're missing the point, the citizens had to dig the information out of them.
    Life's tough.

    I wonder if the increased costs of healthcare in anyway impacted the govt scheduled pay raises. I'm betting not.
    You wouldn't want to go "dig the information out of them" or anything.
    Last edited by misterman; 02-08-12 at 09:05 AM.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by gingern44 View Post
    Losing something? If that's not the perfect entitlement mentality...
    So if you were employed, and got a pay cut, you wouldn't complain one bit?

    Sure.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    Quote Originally Posted by gingern44 View Post
    I tend to look at it as paying your fair share. I owned the company and I can assure you my benefits never came close to those of my best friend whose been working for a state university for about the same time frame. His HC was far superior to mine and for 20 of the last 25 yrs he paid virtually nothing. I along with my employees paid his healthcare. How about time off? He gets more time off in 1 year than I did in a decade or my employees took in a 5yrs. As a matter of fact he's about to go N Orleans to an annual conference. I'll be getting a call from Bourbon St in a couple of weeks to rub it in. Oh, by the way, I and my employees pay for that too.
    When I see a friend who is doing better than me, I think I want to do better, not that I want to bring his salary and benefits down.

    As worse off as I am? How about standing up and help pay for your own healthcare? The private sector has been providing the public sector with cadilac benefits forever, while I and my employees pay twice as much and get cavaliers.
    So let's make the private sector benefits better.
    And how in the world the world has the right wing screwed private sector workers?
    Really?

    And yes, small businesses are often in survival mode. But then they succeed, and thrive, and grow. If they can only lower wages and benefits, that's not success.

    Overall, Americans' wages haven't risen past inflation for 30 years (except the top 10%). Despite being more productive. There's something wrong. THAT is what "fair share" is about.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: Gingrich Suggests Illegally Firing Federal Employees Over Liberal Views

    When I see a friend who is doing better than me, I think I want to do better, not that I want to bring his salary and benefits down.
    As I've told him I don't begrudge him anything, we(the citizens) made the deal with him. He also gets the notion that HC costs have been exploding and the levels of his contribution
    are going to have to be more realistic. He's a big dog so I'm not remotely worried about him. He and I disagree on one issue. Govt retirement has traditionally included lifetime defined benefits as far as healthcare. Think about someone 25yrs old starting to work in the govt right now. We are promising that 25 or 30yrs from now we're going to provide lifetime HC. My grandchildren are on the hook for those future costs, whatever they maybe. The private sector figured out that defined benefit programs for retirees are unsustainable, ask GM.



    So let's make the private sector benefits better.
    Sounds good. The only question is how.

    And yes, small businesses are often in survival mode. But then they succeed, and thrive, and grow. If they can only lower wages and benefits, that's not success.
    Overall, Americans' wages haven't risen past inflation for 30 years (except the top 10%). Despite being more productive. There's something wrong. THAT is what "fair share" is about.
    Today, survival is success.

    I agree wage stagnation is a major problem. The question again is what to do about it. The lefts answer seems to always be more govt. It seems to me most business people would have a 2 word answer to what the govt could do to help, "Go Away". Whether we like it or not we are in a global competition. It's tough to compete when you spend a large part of your time and resources navigating the myriad of fed, state, county, city, interstate regional, intrastate regional (I could go on), bureaucracies. None of which have your companies well being at heart. And all of whom grow every day. Years ago I heard a line "today you can't swap pocket knives without 2 lawyers, six bureaucrats and $40k". It's much worse now and getting more so by the day.

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