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Thread: How Long Should We Help the Unemployed?

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    Re: How Long Should We Help the Unemployed?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnWOlin View Post
    http://money.cnn.com/2011/12/13/news/economy/unemployment_benefits_extension/index.htm

    I
    found this to be a very interesting article and before I might say extend but I tend to agree--several unemployed don't need these extensions they need to learn to adapt and build up. This is a nonstarter to get unemployment down by continuously extending the unemployment for those out of work for over a year. I mean come on a year? Jesus Christ.
    It is Obama's instinct to have as many unemployed/unemployable people as possible wholly dependent on the Government for their living expenses.

    This way it is reasoned that there will always be a majority who vote Democratic.

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    Re: How Long Should We Help the Unemployed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    I'm all for a system similar to what Wisconsin has been using for the past few years.....

    Anyone coming into the system would be classified based on their education and job skills. Over a period of time (six months to a year) they would be offered educational and job training programs to bring them to a minimum of a GED level education and some job skill (if necessary). At the point they are deemed both educated and skilled they should be given 26 weeks to find employment or they get cut off completely. During those 26 weeks they should be required to check in weekly to ensure they are actively seeking employment. Those check-ins would also allow the administration to provide them with information on potential job opportunities with their skills.... IN OTHER AREAS OF THE COUNTRY.
    So, how does someone without a job have the money to be able to move across the country.

    I moved only 500 miles a couple of years ago and between moving expenses, deposits (and loss of deposits), the total cost was about $5,000 - a couple thousand more than I budgeted for.

    And I had a job on both ends of the move. I can't imagine someone who has been struggling can simply afford to pack up and move.

    That's part of the problem. There are several parts of the country where there are ample open jobs and other pockets of high unemployment. But those who need the jobs can't afford to get to where the jobs are.

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    Re: How Long Should We Help the Unemployed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pointy View Post
    It is Obama's instinct to have as many unemployed/unemployable people as possible wholly dependent on the Government for their living expenses.

    This way it is reasoned that there will always be a majority who vote Democratic.
    Rolls eyes at obvious propaganda...

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    Re: How Long Should We Help the Unemployed?

    Quote Originally Posted by evanescence View Post
    To me, essentials are basic things like a safe place to live, a basic/cheap phone plan (for employment purposes), internet (because i do half of my courses online so it's for education), utilities, at least one car, gas, groceries, then there's insurance (which is our third largest expense monthly after the mortgage), health care costs out of pocket, home and car repair, the unexpected repair bill, I'm sure I'm missing something. All of these things add up and it aint cheap. If I worked full time, we'd need to add to that the cost of daycare for two kids under five, one not potty trained. We've cut cable tv, our cell phone plan (we're now on my parent's family plan), and we rarely go out. My point is, many other people are in similar situations. And to be honest, if his job didn't pay more than what unemployment offered, we would have held out. And frankly, I don't blame the people that do hold out. What these people are getting in unemployment is nothing compared to the trillions the pentagon lost in a single year. Corporations are making record profits while the average person is supposed to "cut back." I don't buy it.
    Worrying about the fiscal responsibility of others will take you to an early grave. I don't understand your beef with "corporations"? Explain please.
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    Re: How Long Should We Help the Unemployed?

    Quote Originally Posted by MarineTpartier View Post
    Worrying about the fiscal responsibility of others will take you to an early grave. I don't understand your beef with "corporations"? Explain please.
    That would require a thread by itself. I disagree with the very premise of their existence- corporate personhood. There are many reasons why, but one of the main arguments against corporations is that they contribute less to the societies they exist within than what they take from it. The externalities are not being considered by most individuals who support corporations. It should be apparent that "trickle down economics" has failed.
    “In politics, stupidity is not a handicap.” -Napoleon

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    Re: How Long Should We Help the Unemployed?

    Quote Originally Posted by evanescence View Post
    That would require a thread by itself. I disagree with the very premise of their existence- corporate personhood. There are many reasons why, but one of the main arguments against corporations is that they contribute less to the societies they exist within than what they take from it. The externalities are not being considered by most individuals who support corporations. It should be apparent that "trickle down economics" has failed.
    How would you then make up for the loss of corporate taxes? That is a huge part of our tax code that would, I assume (who knows with our gov't), be transferred to income tax. This would hurt our economy more than help it, I believe. Not arguing, just like to know your opinion on it. You seem knowledgeable about economics.
    As far as trickle down economics, I agree something needs to happen to make these guys put their money back into the market. It shouldn't be any sort of gov't intrusion though. The Fed and Europe, to an extent, are the reason they are holding on to their money to begin with. I don't think trickle down economics has failed, I just think these guys are doing what I talked about earlier. The smart thing. Holding on to their money because they realized bad times were coming. Thats what I did, thats what you did, what's wrong with that?
    “Mr. Speaker, I once again find myself compelled to vote against the annual budget resolution for a very simple reason: it makes government bigger.” ― Ron Paul
    Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of Liberty. – Thomas Jefferson

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    Re: How Long Should We Help the Unemployed?

    Quote Originally Posted by MarineTpartier View Post
    How would you then make up for the loss of corporate taxes? That is a huge part of our tax code that would, I assume (who knows with our gov't), be transferred to income tax. This would hurt our economy more than help it, I believe. Not arguing, just like to know your opinion on it. You seem knowledgeable about economics.
    As far as trickle down economics, I agree something needs to happen to make these guys put their money back into the market. It shouldn't be any sort of gov't intrusion though. The Fed and Europe, to an extent, are the reason they are holding on to their money to begin with. I don't think trickle down economics has failed, I just think these guys are doing what I talked about earlier. The smart thing. Holding on to their money because they realized bad times were coming. Thats what I did, thats what you did, what's wrong with that?
    I'm not sure that we'd be missing as much as they claim, as far as corporate taxes are concerned. Many fortune 500 corporations have a negative tax liability. I can find the links later if you want. I support the fair tax or some form of it. I know it seems strange from what I've said so far, but I actually don't believe in Big Government. Then there's corporate subsidies and tax loopholes. Along with corporate personhood, the IRS needs to be flushed as well. Just my opinion though-
    “In politics, stupidity is not a handicap.” -Napoleon

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    Re: How Long Should We Help the Unemployed?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnWOlin View Post
    http://money.cnn.com/2011/12/13/news/economy/unemployment_benefits_extension/index.htm

    I
    found this to be a very interesting article and before I might say extend but I tend to agree--several unemployed don't need these extensions they need to learn to adapt and build up. This is a nonstarter to get unemployment down by continuously extending the unemployment for those out of work for over a year. I mean come on a year? Jesus Christ.
    Well, how much was TARP?

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    Re: How Long Should We Help the Unemployed?

    Quote Originally Posted by evanescence View Post
    I'm not sure that we'd be missing as much as they claim, as far as corporate taxes are concerned. Many fortune 500 corporations have a negative tax liability. I can find the links later if you want. I support the fair tax or some form of it. I know it seems strange from what I've said so far, but I actually don't believe in Big Government. Then there's corporate subsidies and tax loopholes. Along with corporate personhood, the IRS needs to be flushed as well. Just my opinion though-
    Wholeheartedly agree on tax code reform. We need to simplify the tax code yesterday. By last count the friggin thing is 84,000 pages. Thats ridiculous.
    “Mr. Speaker, I once again find myself compelled to vote against the annual budget resolution for a very simple reason: it makes government bigger.” ― Ron Paul
    Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of Liberty. – Thomas Jefferson

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    Re: How Long Should We Help the Unemployed?

    Quote Originally Posted by TNAR View Post
    I agree. In fact, jobs are overrated. We should just pay everyone an unemployment check as soon as they graduate from high school until they start collecting Social Security.
    I've heard that unemployment benefits actually create jobs.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
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