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Bill To Be Voted On Today Would Allow The Military To Sweep Up US Citizens At

Hound

The war on terror was invented by the Feds. The purpose is to demand more money and power from people. So when the intelligence and Pentagon are there, the terror will be there too. If there is none, they create one.

Human have hound in their house to protect their family against the wolf. As the hound getting more power, they don't want to be guards any more. They want to be master. So the hound trained some wolf they captured. Let these agent wolf to attack and kill human. Human is frightened. They give hound whatever they demanded -money, power ..... Now hound become master. When they need something, they let the agent wolf have an attack on human, then said, this is a long war, to protect your lives, I need warrantless surveillance, more budget fund, torture prison.... . The hound repeated its demand, "This enemy has struck us, and they will strike again, and we'll give our folks the tools necessary to protect the country," if you don't then the hound "can not protect ourselves".

That's why we saw after 10 years, occasionally a wolf or two were captured. But hundreds of thousands of innocent people died. There is an endless war to control people. A constant blackmail for more power.
 
jasonxe said:
The terrorists hate us for our freedoms so if we take it away...they won't hate us anymore.
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Brilliant! I never thought of it that way before!

We are constantly being told that our enemies hate us for our freedom so your logic must be absolutely correct. And here I thought they hated us because of our constant meddling in their way of life!
 
TNAR said:
Brilliant! I never thought of it that way before!

We are constantly being told that our enemies hate us for our freedom so your logic must be absolutely correct. And here I thought they hated us because of our constant meddling in their way of life!
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I like "they hate us for our freedom" better. It's the Paris Hilton defense - "they hate me because I'm rich and hot." It's so Cold War too.
 
This is a piece of **** bill. It should not stand. If our leaders cannot see this, bring on the courts.
 
Congress Approves Provisions for Indefinite Arrests and Detention of US Citizens

, SF Conservative Examiner
December 18, 2011

Enemies of the People & U.S. Constitution; Congressional Traitors Approved Provisions for Indefinite Arrests, and Detentions of U.S. Citizens, with no Due Processes, Mainly Those Who Criticize Government:

S.1867, the National Defense Authorization Act, attacks on our liberties was passed to the dismay of Libertarians all over.

Congress Approves Provisions for Indefinite Arrests and Detention of US Citizens - San Francisco Conservative | Examiner.com
 
The Bill does not allow for the indefinite detention of American citizens, without trial or charge.

it doesn't allow for anyone who is legally residing within the USA, to be detained without trial or charge.
 
Thunder said:
The Bill does not allow for the indefinite detention of American citizens, without trial or charge.

it doesn't allow for anyone who is legally residing within the USA, to be detained without trial or charge.
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Yes, it seems that they have changed the wording to avoid this possibility. Of course I don't speak legalese so I am by no means an expert in this matter.
 
TNAR said:
Yes, it seems that they have changed the wording to avoid this possibility. Of course I don't speak legalese so I am by no means an expert in this matter.
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Anyone have a link to the change that does this?
 
Deuce said:
Anyone have a link to the change that does this?
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Here.

See Section 1032(b).

If you look back on page 1 or 2 of this thread you'll see the original text (which was formerly in section 1031 I believe).
 
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Boo Radley said:
This is a piece of **** bill. It should not stand. If our leaders cannot see this, bring on the courts.
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Agreed.

Honestly, the feds are completely psychotic. First they declare that illegals can only be held by local authorities for 48 hours... because "they have rights, too"... then they turn around and pull something so blatantly unconstitutional against legal residents and citizens that the mind positively boggles.
 
DiAnna said:
Agreed.

Honestly, the feds are completely psychotic. First they declare that illegals can only be held by local authorities for 48 hours... because "they have rights, too"... then they turn around and pull something so blatantly unconstitutional against legal residents and citizens that the mind positively boggles.
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how is it unConstitutional if no citizens or legal residents of the USA will be effected?
 
DiAnna said:
Agreed.

Honestly, the feds are completely psychotic. First they declare that illegals can only be held by local authorities for 48 hours... because "they have rights, too"... then they turn around and pull something so blatantly unconstitutional against legal residents and citizens that the mind positively boggles.
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I think it is trying to appease all the forces coming at them. They need to think more, and appease less.
 
Preparations for a conflict with Iran?
 
Thunder said:
The Bill does not allow for the indefinite detention of American citizens, without trial or charge.

it doesn't allow for anyone who is legally residing within the USA, to be detained without trial or charge.
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.

Read this:

Quote, "ACLUs statement regarding that section ^^


“Don’t be confused by anyone claiming that the indefinite detention legislation does not apply to American citizens. It does. There is an exemption for American citizens from the mandatory detention requirement (section 1032 of the bill), but no exemption for American citizens from the authorization to use the military to indefinitely detain people without charge or trial (section 1031 of the bill). So, the result is that, under the bill, the military has the power to indefinitely imprison American citizens, but it does not have to use its power unless ordered to do so. But you don’t have to believe us. Instead, read what one of the bill’s sponsors, Sen. Lindsey Graham said about it on the Senate floor: “1031, the statement of authority to detain, does apply to American citizens and it designates the world as the battlefield, including the homeland.”

SEC. 1031. AFFIRMATION OF AUTHORITY OF THE ARMED FORCES OF THE UNITED STATES TO DETAIN COVERED PERSONS PURSUANT TO THE AUTHORIZATION FOR USE OF MILITARY FORCE. (a) In General- Congress affirms that the authority of the President to use all necessary and appropriate force pursuant to the Authorization for Use of Military Force (Public Law 107-40) includes the authority for the Armed Forces of the United States to detain covered persons (as defined in subsection (b)) pending disposition under the law of war. (b) Covered Persons- A covered person under this section is any person as follows: (1) A person who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, or harbored those responsible for those attacks. (2) A person who was a part of or substantially supported al-Qaeda, the Taliban, or associated forces that are engaged in hostilities against the United States or its coalition partners, including any person who has committed a belligerent act or has directly supported such hostilities in aid of such enemy forces. (c) Disposition Under Law of War- The disposition of a person under the law of war as described in subsection (a) may include the following: (1) Detention under the law of war without trial until the end of the hostilities authorized by the Authorization for Use of Military Force. (2) Trial under chapter 47A of title 10, United States Code (as amended by the Military Commissions Act of 2009 (title XVIII of Public Law 111-84)). (3) Transfer for trial by an alternative court or competent tribunal having lawful jurisdiction. (4) Transfer to the custody or control of the person's country of origin, any other foreign country, or any other foreign entity.

Kiss Your Rights Goodbye, America.
 
I am laughing while the right wing suddenly discovers that the ACLU isn't so bad after all.
 
Thunder said:
how is it unConstitutional if no citizens or legal residents of the USA will be effected?
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The Constitution says alot more than how citizens or legal residents of the US will be treated.
 
misterman said:
The Constitution says alot more than how citizens or legal residents of the US will be treated.
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This is true. I am often surprised how many seem to think law works only one way, on rights, but not responsibilities. It governs not only who it can be done to, but what can be done period. It otherwords, law governs behavior, regardless of who the act is being inflicted on.
 
katsung47 said:
.

Read this:

Quote, "ACLUs statement regarding that section ^^


“Don’t be confused by anyone claiming that the indefinite detention legislation does not apply to American citizens. It does. There is an exemption for American citizens from the mandatory detention requirement (section 1032 of the bill), but no exemption for American citizens from the authorization to use the military to indefinitely detain people without charge or trial (section 1031 of the bill). So, the result is that, under the bill, the military has the power to indefinitely imprison American citizens, but it does not have to use its power unless ordered to do so. But you don’t have to believe us. Instead, read what one of the bill’s sponsors, Sen. Lindsey Graham said about it on the Senate floor: “1031, the statement of authority to detain, does apply to American citizens and it designates the world as the battlefield, including the homeland.”...
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even the very-Liberal & biased ACLU is sometimes wrong.
 
Thunder said:
even the very-Liberal & biased ACLU is sometimes wrong.
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Yet you offer no evidence that it is wrong in this case. Either explain why its wrong or stop saying it is.
 
Thunder said:
read the Bill, as the paranoid interpretation of it is clearly wrong.
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What a completely lame circular argument.

I read it. It says what I think it says. Either support your argument or stop wasting everyone's time.
 
misterman said:
What a completely lame circular argument.

I read it. It says what I think it says. Either support your argument or stop wasting everyone's time.
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the Bill clealy exempts American citizens & legal aliens, from indefinite detention without charge or trial.

if you can't see that, I can't help you.
 
katsung47 said:
Read this: Quote, "ACLUs statement regarding that section ^^
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Thunder said:
even the very-Liberal & biased ACLU is sometimes wrong.
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misterman said:
Yet you offer no evidence that it is wrong in this case. Either explain why its wrong or stop saying it is.
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It seems that the ACLU was not wrong when they issued this statement but is wrong now. For those unaware, bills migrate through many different wordings and forms while they are before Congress. This particular bill changed specifically regarding this section when it became known that there was no protection for U.S. citizens.

The final bill as signed into law by the president is located at the GPO here. The section pertinent to this discussion is 1022 entitled Military custody for foreign al-Qaeda terrorists.

NDAA Section 1022(b)(1) said:
UNITED STATES CITIZENS- The requirement to detain a person in military custody under this section does not extend to citizens of the United States.
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Thunder said:
the Bill clealy exempts American citizens & legal aliens, from indefinite detention without charge or trial.

if you can't see that, I can't help you.
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Please explain exactly why this is wrong. I hope it's wrong. But you haven't shown that it's wrong yet:

“Don’t be confused by anyone claiming that the indefinite detention legislation does not apply to American citizens. It does. There is an exemption for American citizens from the mandatory detention requirement (section 1032 of the bill), but no exemption for American citizens from the authorization to use the military to indefinitely detain people without charge or trial (section 1031 of the bill). So, the result is that, under the bill, the military has the power to indefinitely imprison American citizens, but it does not have to use its power unless ordered to do so. But you don’t have to believe us. Instead, read what one of the bill’s sponsors, Sen. Lindsey Graham said about it on the Senate floor: “1031, the statement of authority to detain, does apply to American citizens and it designates the world as the battlefield, including the homeland.”
 
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