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The 53%: We are NOT Occupy Wall Street

cpwill said:
well, he had to dig his way out of 35K in Student Debt - which he apparently did so through the unique mechanism of hard work.


however, those of us who are tea party sympathizers appreciate your concern and pledge to continue to push for lowering his taxes :)
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Having graduated from a top 15 college I find his performance lackluster.
 
jambalaya said:
Their demands include living wage gaurantee, pay off my student loans, forgive pretty much all debt, single payer healthcare, free college tuition. What do you call that exactly?
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they have an offical list of demands? i did not know that, do you have link?
 
samsmart said:
You seem to think that the OWS crowd is demanding more welfare benefits, which does not seem to be the case.

Rather, many of the OWSers are young college students who are studying so they can get a good job but are fearful, for a variety of reasons, that there won't be any that pays the salary level they need to pay off the loans they accrue.
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Nonsense. The unemployment rate for college graduates is 4.2% and the average starting salary is $50,034.

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/empsit.pdf

Class of 2011 receiving higher starting salaries
 
WOW!!!!! The right wing is really scared of this movement. Now we get this manufactured "response".

I can hear Buffalo Springfield singing right now

Paranoia strikes deep
Into your life it will creep
It starts when you're always afraid
You step out of line, the man come and take you away
 
Jambalaya said:
Their demands include living wage gaurantee, pay off my student loans, forgive pretty much all debt, single payer healthcare, free college tuition. What do you call that exactly?


VanceMack said:
Socialism? Low-rent greed? Typical of people used to sponging off others?
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Socialism??

Socialism is where everybody shares in the ownership of production and distribution. This is a case of a free loader who thinks the current distribution is unfair. That's not Socialism. It's amazing how so many people who casually toss the word "Socialism" around, actually have little idea of what Socialism actually is.

Your other descriptions not withstanding.
 
haymarket said:
WOW!!!!! The right wing is really scared of this movement. Now we get this manufactured "response".

I can hear Buffalo Springfield singing right now

Paranoia strikes deep
Into your life it will creep
It starts when you're always afraid
You step out of line, the man come and take you away
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Actually, America is growing bored with it. Politicians are keeping their distance and there is hardly any media coverage unless they provoke confrontations with the police.
 
VanceMack said:
Ah! So THATS what the OWS protesters are upset about? they cant get liver transplants? They arent a bunch of whiny spoiled little ****s that want someone else to pay off their student loans? Huh...guess we are missing that whole "Occupy Wall Street for liver transplants" group. Or is that liver transplant argument just another bull**** argument because the anti-banker/broker influence in politics argument sort of falls flat when you still support the democrats sucking down that cash?
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i support smaller and more efficient government like most do. How many of your friends do you hear whining about how they have to pay back student loans? I have many friends who are in debt from student loans, and none of them whine or expect somebody else to pay for them. They do, however, wish for our politicians to represent their best interests rather than continually giving into the wishes of corporate lobbyists. Last I checked, the Democrats were willing to make massive spending cuts in exchange for more federal tax revenues and the GOP was the side blocking any progress from being made.

Also, protesting isn't whining, it's standing up for yourself. And I'm happy to see my generation taking an interest in politics. It's about time more of us started paying attention to how this country works.
 
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toomuchtime_ said:
Actually, America is growing bored with it. Politicians are keeping their distance and there is hardly any media coverage unless they provoke confrontations with the police.
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Bored with it?!?!?! Can you then explain the eruption of threads on this very site obsessing about it to the point of dwelling on the intimate details of ones bathroom habits?

I suspect politicians are strangely silent about it since they do not want to come down on the "wrong side" of this - whatever that may prove to be down the road.
 
samsmart said:
And yet, the issue for many OWSers isn't that they're unwilling to work hard - rather, it's that they can't get the jobs to pay them the salary they need to pay off their student loans and housing and health insurance and other relevant bills.
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Alabama is Hiring

...In Alabama and other parts of the country, farmers must look beyond the nation's borders for labor because many Americans simply don't want the backbreaking, low-paying jobs immigrants are willing to take. Politicians who support the law say over time more unemployed Americans will fill these jobs. They insist it's too early to consider the law a failure, yet numbers from the governor's office show only nominal interest.

"I've had people calling me wanting to work," Smith said. "I haven't turned any of them down, but they're not any good. It's hard work, they just don't work like the Hispanics with experience."..

"People in Alabama are not going to do this," said Smith, who grows about 75 acres of tomatoes in the northeast part of the state. "They'd work one day and then just wouldn't show up again."...

It may make sense for some to sit on the couch. Unemployment benefits provide up to $265 a week while a minimum wage job, at $7.25 an hour for 40 hours, brings in $290.
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Mickey Shane said:
Those three young men holding up the cards with their stories are living proof that you can't get ahead in America.
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:doh

failure. all three of those guys will end up way ahead. I'm making fairly middling pay (i'm an E-5 in the military with a family, our pay is readily available online), and I'm doing pretty good and will likely end up a multi-millionaire. you work hard in the beginning, and then you achieve in the end. if you don't get blessed with amazing riches in the beginning, that's fine - that's why you work for it.
 
haymarket said:
WOW!!!!! The right wing is really scared of this movement. Now we get this manufactured "response".

I can hear Buffalo Springfield singing right now

Paranoia strikes deep
Into your life it will creep
It starts when you're always afraid
You step out of line, the man come and take you away
Click to expand...

I am NOT right-wing. . . just like all the OWS people aren't all a bunch of liberals.
 
It's like we have to teach every generation what it is they need, and try to align their wants with what they need.
No, you don't need handouts, you need the freedom to live any way you choose.
No, you don't want to be an indentured servant, please stop offering, work hard and stop worrying. Drink some beer or wine, why the **** do you think they are a cornerstone of human culture? You should live at home if you're worried, no shame. Haven't asian immigrants shown you how to start from nothing and make a great living in the land of opportunity? Oh yes, your issue is denial, which prevents that....

cpwill said:
you work hard in the beginning, and then you achieve in the end.
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Exactly. I admit it took someone far more hard working than myself to show me just how lazy I was. I mean, I worked hard and had a great work ethic, but he worked way beyond what I thought was practical. Eventually I came around and adopted the behavior of his, that made him a success, and low and behold it had the same effect on me. That kid asking for the end, i.e. student loans paid off now, before he's done the hard work? How unethical can you get?
 
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Mustachio said:
i support smaller and more efficient government like most do. How many of your friends do you hear whining about how they have to pay back student loans? I have many friends who are in debt from student loans, and none of them whine or expect somebody else to pay for them. They do, however, wish for our politicians to represent their best interests rather than continually giving into the wishes of corporate lobbyists. Last I checked, the Democrats were willing to make massive spending cuts in exchange for more federal tax revenues and the GOP was the side blocking any progress from being made.

Also, protesting isn't whining, it's standing up for yourself. And I'm happy to see my generation taking an interest in politics. It's about time more of us started paying attention to how this country works.
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If you are really in favor of "smaller and more efficient government" you don't need more tax revenues, just spending cuts and more efficient use of existing tax revenues. When you raise taxes on the wealthy, you are reducing the amount of investment capital available to the private sector and sparing the government the need to become more efficient.

If you really want smaller, more efficient government but still think revenues should be increased, then the tax bill should be required to specify exactly what that money will be spent on and require the government to periodically give an accounting of how that money was actually spent.
 
Mickey Shane said:
Those three young men holding up the cards with their stories are living proof that you can't get ahead in America. All three are sad stories. The men are just too naive to read their own signs and understand what they mean.

They're tough, but they seem to be nice guys, and we all know where the nice guys finish in this country.
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I don't know if I can identify with that. I know for many people it was this seemingly string of circumstances that built up and built up to create this monster snowball effect, and there is seemingly no way out. I can sympathize with that. However, I am a great deal more optimistic than to accept the notion that many of us are just doomed. Times are tough, but I can't quite call foul on the whole system nor know what would dramatically improve our lot. I am still a believer in the American Dream, and I still believe in our ability to have some good amount of control in our lives.
 
The sad thing is that I think a good portion of people (roughly 53%) are kind of misinterpreting the original intent of OWS. I think it has more to do with protesting the current state the economy is in and the way the government bends to corporate interests instead of the 99% of people who aren't rich. I don't think the intent of OWS is to say, "Wahhhh!!! Rich people have more money than me!!!", though I'm sure there are some involved in OWS who feel that way.
 
here seems to be a disconnect on both sides here. The right wingers do not seem to realize that collage tuition has risen by about 8% per year. FinAid | Saving for College | Tuition Inflation This means I can borrow more money that I can pay back if I pursue a doctorate ( which I am atm). You think doctors make too much money? Wait to see what I charge as an engineer just to pay back my loans and make a house payment and medical insurance! The point here is that if you look at the inflation rate of the entire 1800,s and then look at the inflation rate of the 2000-2010 you may understand what is happening and why these students are protesting.
Also the Pope has a bit to say about this. Pope Benedict Radical Liberal? - YouTube
The students do not realize that though things are definitely in the toilet atm, robbing from anyone no matter the reason is still theft. Say for instance John Q earned 20million honestly and gave 5 million to charity of his own volition. He pays 45% in taxes that is not really passed on to his customers. He tries very hard to do the right thing. You or I cannot rob him of his earnings. I know that there are many who have influenced polocy in Washington and used massive wealth to get bills passed as they desired. There are many that do not. Once you allow the government to take John Q's money you then allow them to take your money. Now realize that in America you are in the top 12% wealthiest people on earth. Do you want the UN to take your money? (This is why America is now 14 Trillion in debt BTW....International redistribution of wealth).
Both sides need to stop and patiently and carefully listen to the other. Once you do that you can learn a great deal and come to a real solution.
 
cpwill said:
:doh

failure. all three of those guys will end up way ahead. I'm making fairly middling pay (i'm an E-5 in the military with a family, our pay is readily available online), and I'm doing pretty good and will likely end up a multi-millionaire. you work hard in the beginning, and then you achieve in the end. if you don't get blessed with amazing riches in the beginning, that's fine - that's why you work for it.
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Cute, a GI telling me, a 20 year framing carpenter about hard work.
 
The strange thing about your story, Cpwill, about the Hispanic farm workers, is that you think the solution is to make life harder for unemployed people, rather than provide adequate compensation to workers for doing their jobs.
 
Fiddytree said:
I don't know if I can identify with that. I know for many people it was this seemingly string of circumstances that built up and built up to create this monster snowball effect, and there is seemingly no way out. I can sympathize with that. However, I am a great deal more optimistic than to accept the notion that many of us are just doomed. Times are tough, but I can't quite call foul on the whole system nor know what would dramatically improve our lot. I am still a believer in the American Dream, and I still believe in our ability to have some good amount of control in our lives.
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Well good, optimism is an underrated philosophy. I'm certainly not going to tell you how the movie ends. You go Fiddy! Should I live another 35 years, I'll get back to you.
 
haymarket said:
Bored with it?!?!?! Can you then explain the eruption of threads on this very site obsessing about it to the point of dwelling on the intimate details of ones bathroom habits?

I suspect politicians are strangely silent about it since they do not want to come down on the "wrong side" of this - whatever that may prove to be down the road.
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There are only a handful of threads about OWS on this site and nearly all of them that were started recently have to do with confrontations with the police. Out or nearly 14,000 members of this message board, there are only a few of us who are showing any interest in anything about OWS other than their confrontations with the police. Dem politicians are staying away because they realize that supporting a group of people who are draining the city treasuries of already impoverished cities and provoking confrontations with police will not play well in the upcoming elections.
 
Government, particulary the "nanny state" variety, is the problem. The OWS folks are not protesting Government. Bottom line is that they want more Government. So as to make things more "fair". :roll:
 
Mustachio said:
i support smaller and more efficient government like most do. How many of your friends do you hear whining about how they have to pay back student loans? I have many friends who are in debt from student loans, and none of them whine or expect somebody else to pay for them. They do, however, wish for our politicians to represent their best interests rather than continually giving into the wishes of corporate lobbyists. Last I checked, the Democrats were willing to make massive spending cuts in exchange for more federal tax revenues and the GOP was the side blocking any progress from being made.

Also, protesting isn't whining, it's standing up for yourself. And I'm happy to see my generation taking an interest in politics. It's about time more of us started paying attention to how this country works.
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WHo is getting their pockets lined by the brokers and bankers? Who has their stink on em? thats right...the dems. Both parties take in cash from corporations, but one party takes in the lions share from banks and brokers...and those politicians have a D beside their name.

These protests are full of people whining about their student loans. Whining about how unfair life is. How unfair it is the rich have more. Wah. life sucs...grab a bucket. You want success? You dont get it bitching about the success of others.

Thats a funny line...the democrats want to make massive spending cuts in exchange for higher taxes. have you READ what is proposed? 3 trillion in cuts to DEFICIT SPENDING over the next 10 years. Current trends have us deficit spending 1.3 trillion ANNUALY. Forecast over that 10 years, at current spending we will add another 13 trillion to the current 15.5 trillion. If the democrats grand offer goes through it would only be 10 TRILLION over ten years. Got kids? Got grandkids? Go throatpunch them right now and toughen them up so they can be prepared to cover 25 trillion in debt because of this generations stupidity. And thats what is comical...you call that 3 trillion 'progress' and 'massive'.
 
Paschendale said:
The strange thing about your story, Cpwill, about the Hispanic farm workers, is that you think the solution is to make life harder for unemployed people, rather than provide adequate compensation to workers for doing their jobs.
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And you still arent offering to give them jobs and adequate compensation. The unions still arent opening factories. Deficit spending isnt creating jobs. Its still all about SOMEONE ELSE...right?
 
VanceMack said:
WHo is getting their pockets lined by the brokers and bankers? Who has their stink on em? thats right...the dems. Both parties take in cash from corporations, but one party takes in the lions share from banks and brokers...and those politicians have a D beside their name.

These protests are full of people whining about their student loans. Whining about how unfair life is. How unfair it is the rich have more. Wah. life sucs...grab a bucket. You want success? You dont get it bitching about the success of others.

Thats a funny line...the democrats want to make massive spending cuts in exchange for higher taxes. have you READ what is proposed? 3 trillion in cuts to DEFICIT SPENDING over the next 10 years. Current trends have us deficit spending 1.3 trillion ANNUALY. Forecast over that 10 years, at current spending we will add another 13 trillion to the current 15.5 trillion. If the democrats grand offer goes through it would only be 10 TRILLION over ten years. Got kids? Got grandkids? Go throatpunch them right now and toughen them up so they can be prepared to cover 25 trillion in debt because of this generations stupidity. And thats what is comical...you call that 3 trillion 'progress' and 'massive'.
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What figures are you talking about? Who voted for wall street during the 2008 bailout? Republicans. Who voted for them again on the issue of financial reform? Republicans. Didn't you read any of these articles last year about how wall street shifted gears to back the GOP?

Frankly, sounds like you talk a lot and do very little homework.

Maybe you should stop judging people and start listening to them, you'd learn more.
 
Mustachio said:
What figures are you talking about? Who voted for wall street during the 2008 bailout? Republicans. Who voted for them again on the issue of financial reform? Republicans. Didn't you read any of these articles last year about how wall street shifted gears to back the GOP?

Frankly, sounds like you talk a lot and do very little homework.

Maybe you should stop judging people and start listening to them, you'd learn more.
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Did you bother to even read your little article or were you just too excited over the headline? "In a report released late Tuesday, CRP found that people in the securities and investment industry have dramatically reversed their campaign contribution trends, shifting from overwhelming support of Democrats in 2009, to an equally overwhelming support of Republicans in 2010" Someone is just a LITTLE bit selective about their outrage and blame...arent you? Both parties have been doing this for decades. Info me...who controlled the house and senate (and thus all spending legislation) in 2008?

And hey...I dont blame you for abandoning the whole "Democrat proposals for deficit cuts" argument...that was a loser from the get-go.
 
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