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Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

Jryan said:
So you are saying, if we use non-lethal force and someone "accidentally" dies, this is okay...
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Im saying your scenario is not at applicable (oh...wait...you KNOW what I am saying) and that sometimes in the course of administering law, bad things happen to stupid people. Would you like me to draw it out with stick figures? I think there is a program for that.
 
Caine said:
Umm... Okay?

Your coming in to defend a completely off topic and irrelevant strawman created as a dodgy reply to a direct question on where the intent was to "bash in people's skulls" asked to a yet DIFFERENT poster than the one who created the strawman in the first place...


You folks really don't like to debate much do you?
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Wait...wait...what if that PLASTIC knife was part of a SET...and...it was in a picnic basket...
 
VanceMack said:
Im saying your scenario is not at applicable (oh...wait...you KNOW what I am saying) and that sometimes in the course of administering law, bad things happen to stupid people. Would you like me to draw it out with stick figures? I think there is a program for that.
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So you are saying, if we use non-lethal force and someone "accidentally" dies, this is okay...

**Hint: This is AKA lethal force**
 
Caine said:
Now this right here is a decent video.........with a major flaw that I will get into in a moment.

It clears up alot of the false statements Ive heard, but also clears up what I thought to be not true but actually isn't.

A. He was not shot in the head by anything, You can clearly see at :20 to :24 that the subject falls, look closely for the guy in the crowd wearing grey. However, You will notice right before he falls, the riot control agents were deployed well off to the side and not directly on him at that point. Could he have been hit by something that occurred as a result of that? Sure. By saying he was shot in the head implies INTENT to shoot him IN THE HEAD.
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The riot police are pretty darn close to him right behind the barcade.
And you cant even see the guy at all throughout the video until the crowd disperses... You cant see him at all.. I dont know what your talking about at the :20 and :24 mark you cant even see him at all.

B. Some idiot officer actually DID drop a percussion grenade pretty much right on top of the guy. Now, one could state they were doing this to get the crowd back and away so they could go in and assist him... but they didn't bother to do anything for him before the crowd came back after clearing away to help, so that defense goes out the window.
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What happens when one idiot protester does something stupid? The media swarms to it, calls the all of the protesters crazy anarchists who like to break ****, then the riot police come in beat up everyone even the peaceful ones and arrests. What happens when a dumb cop does something like this? "He was doing his job"


C. Contrary to what I was told.... None of those people who began running up to the injured guy looked like Medics to me..... HMM?
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Well usually at protests there really arent actual professionally trained "medics". They usually are just civilians who know a tad bit.

D. None of the Officers bothered to go help the guy, the protesters had cleared out plenty of space for them to go in and help prior to rushing back when they (protesters) noticed him hurt...... That absolutely disgusts me about the Oakland PD.
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Same here.


The part of the video that bothers me.... but it should obviously be taken with a grain of salt at this point knowing the way protesters operate... the video goes from the Ordering them to disburse part straight to riot control already having been deployed..... It doesn't bother to what happened between those points... which is crucial to determine the alleged "Peacefulness" of these protesters.
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:roll:
If you can find any proof that they were being violent i will take it... But it seems like you dont have any of it.
 
How many of the OWS sympathizers were all for whats-his-butt's 1st Amendment rights, when he wasnted to burn the Koran?
 
apdst said:
There is if a cop feels like his personal safety is threatened.

I cant say this enough: If they would have simply complied with police orders, no one would have gotten hurt. It ain't rocket science.
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And if the city just allowed them to peaceably occupy the park there would not have been either......


round and round we go...
 
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I wonder if the Tea Party was ever like this and had this happen to their movement i bet we wouldnt see much of the right defending the police force then...
 
Caine said:
Umm... Okay?

Your coming in to defend a completely off topic and irrelevant strawman created as a dodgy reply to a direct question on where the intent was to "bash in people's skulls" asked to a yet DIFFERENT poster than the one who created the strawman in the first place...


You folks really don't like to debate much do you?
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It's true, cops really can't take jokes...
 
I think Obama is holding a 5000 bux a seat fancy fundraiser 10 miles away from the protest. Is he to good to show up at occupy oakland or something? :-(
 
apdst said:
How many of the OWS sympathizers were all for whats-his-butt's 1st Amendment rights, when he wasnted to burn the Koran?
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Guy can burn the quaran all he wants.... Never saw any "OWS sympathizers" saying he shouldnt be allowed to...
 
Jryan said:
So you are saying, if we use non-lethal force and someone "accidentally" dies, this is okay...
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Well since Vance bothered to try to open the can of worms that was your ABSOLUTELY misdirecting and obvious attempt to avoid directly answering the question ..

Who said that its okay?

When citizens band together with the intent to create and maintain Chaos, **** happens. Its the result of the Chaos the Protesters created... nay... they WANTED.

The majority of the folks that have been showing up to the protests are nothing more than anarchist jack asses seeking to "get in on the action". Why else do more people come out when police incidents occur?
 
jasonxe said:
I think Obama is holding a 5000 bux a seat fancy fundraiser 10 miles away from the protest. Is he to good to show up or something? :-(
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I think that would be kick ass if he showed up haha.
 
Jryan said:
A pathetic argument who I know thinks the rest of the constitution is the highest law in the land, with the exception of #7.
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Ah yes...another consitutional scholar, versed on 'rights' whose talent is wasted on teh interwebz....
 
VanceMack said:
Ah yes...another consitutional scholar, versed on 'rights' whose talent is wasted on teh interwebz....
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Cute, couldn't address the issue so you resort to personal attacks. :lamo:lamo:lamo
 
jasonxe said:
I think Obama is holding a 5000 bux a seat fancy fundraiser 10 miles away from the protest. Is he to good to show up at occupy oakland or something? :-(
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Actually it was $35K...he is in Hollywood...thats the big time there...
 
Jryan said:
Cute, couldn't address the issue so you resort to personal attacks. :lamo:lamo:lamo
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I have SO MUCH addressed the issue. You havent a clue about these 'rights' that you keep spewing on about. You guys sound like a bunch of spoiled little kids stomping your feet..."Its not FAIR!!!"
 
Jryan said:
Cute, couldn't address the issue so you resort to personal attacks. :lamo:lamo:lamo
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Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.

Im still waiting for a post worth reading in response to my request to show proof of.....

INTENT.
 
Swit said:
I assume you hold yourself in the same category, No?
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Helz yes. I have 5 degrees...two advanced...and not a one is in constitutional law, US Code (psssst...just so's ya know...thats where you are most likely to find the actual 'meat' and muscle that details what is laid out in the constitution) and local and state law. Thats why I cede to...you know...the people that ARE and do.
 
apdst said:
There is if a cop feels like his personal safety is threatened.

I cant say this enough: If they would have simply complied with police orders, no one would have gotten hurt. It ain't rocket science.
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You are really big on following orders. I think you missed your time in history when such a toadie attitude was looked at as an asset.
 
Caine said:
Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.

Im still waiting for a post worth reading in response to my request to show proof of.....

INTENT.
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I'll stick with RECKLESS DISREGARD.
 
VanceMack said:
Just like it makes us conservative types laugh when you suddenly pretend to give a **** about vets or police officers. I dont know of too many people conservative or otherwise that have said people dont have a right to protest. That right to protest doesnt mean whatever wherever and however you want. Thats a basic reality that unfortunately too many people are too stupid to understand.
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Yup, you continue to confirm it. If fascism ever comes to the USA, I strongly suspect right wing libertarians will be leading the parade.
 
VanceMack said:
Helz yes. I have 5 degrees...two advanced...and not a one is in constitutional law, US Code (psssst...just so's ya know...thats where you are most likely to find the actual 'meat' and muscle that details what is laid out in the constitution) and local and state law. Thats why I cede to...you know...the people that ARE and do.
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This doesn't seem to be a factual statement there are numerous posts by yourself that are in fact trying to educate people what the 'correct' interpretations of rights are... in this particular thread those of the 1st amendment....

And second, the US code, the body of law that our legislature has passed, must first pass constitutional muster... i.e. the meat and potatoes of the U.S. Constitution is the U.S. Constitution itself.... not its derivative products.
 
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