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Thread: Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

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    Re: Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

    ^ Oh look who showed up to yet another thread to remind us all that the First Amendment realy isn't the first amendment, and that the rights we "think" we have aren't actually real rights unless the government says you have permission to use them.

    What part of FREEDOM OF ASSEMBLY AND SPEECH is not sinking in here?

    You don't need a permit to do ANY of those things, yet municipalities all over this country think that they have a right to apply zoning restrictions to public assembly and tell you when and where you can protest.

    This is systemic violence and the fact that they are bashing in people's skulls for not dispersing on their command is a clear violation of the First Amendment.

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    Re: Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

    Quote Originally Posted by Temporal View Post
    ^ Oh look who showed up to yet another thread to remind us all that the First Amendment realy isn't the first amendment, and that the rights we "think" we have aren't actually real rights unless the government says you have permission to use them.
    What part of FREEDOM OF ASSEMBLY AND SPEECH is not sinking in, here?.
    I thought most rational humans understood the limits on free speech and assembly. Are you saying you don't? Or better, that there are no limits? Please, enlighten us.

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    Re: Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Just goes to prove the old adage...its always fun and games, til someone gets hurt.

    Regardless of what you think, you dont have the 'right' to do whatever you want, wherever you want, and however you want and you damn sure arent the arbiter of law. Protest...fine...have a ball. When the police say...OK...this has to stop, then the true 'peaceful' protester will say, you bet, officer...we'll stop...regroup, figure it out, and come back and press on. Instead we get paint cans, bottles, firecrackers and a whole steady stream of **** YOU MOTHER****ERS!!! and **** YOU PIGS!!! from people who apprently arent smart enough to realize that the police...the ones they say are part of that 99% that they represent...are just enacting law as directed. As usual...instead of being upset with government you are upset with the police. Instead of being upset with themselves for being stupid, they are upset with the police.

    You dont have the right to do whatever you want to do because you THINK you do.
    The police should have to justify every single ounce of force they apply against American citizens.

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    Re: Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    The police should have to justify every single ounce of force they apply against American citizens.
    They have. The people were told to clear the streets and they refused. The police then cleared the streets. Justified. You want to protest? Great. You want to be civilly disobedient? Fine. But when the policeman says its time to change the game then you either change it or face consequences. That you and others dont get that is both a mystery and a comedy.

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    Re: Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

    Quote Originally Posted by Temporal View Post
    ^ Oh look who showed up to yet another thread to remind us all that the First Amendment realy isn't the first amendment, and that the rights we "think" we have aren't actually real rights unless the government says you have permission to use them.

    What part of FREEDOM OF ASSEMBLY AND SPEECH is not sinking in here?

    You don't need a permit to do ANY of those things, yet municipalities all over this country think that they have a right to apply zoning restrictions to public assembly and tell you when and where you can protest. This is systemic violence and the fact that they are bashing in people's skulls for not dispersing on their command is a clear violation of the First Amendment.
    Or...could it be maybe YOU dont have the grasp 'law' that you think you do...

    See...thats the hilarious part...apparently those municiplaities and their decisions have been affirmed by lawyers...and for some reason they arent consulting a random internet blogger on matters of law and constitution. Huh...go figure.
    Last edited by VanceMack; 10-27-11 at 07:08 PM.

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    Re: Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

    Quote Originally Posted by Mach View Post
    Does this old propoganda technique really still work?

    Protestors, who have admittedly no real agenda, just "occupy" public places, and in some cases when they are in areas they cannot be "occupying", and the police tell them, tell them again, warn them, form up a riot line....

    And then protestors provoke them further.....

    And some random person up in their face ends up hurt from what looks to be a very mild stand-off, it's POLICE BRUTALITY 99% OWC **** YEA!! Please.

    It's an attempt to manufacture sympathy support. We have no agenda, so we'll **** with the police and break the law, and when they don't take it, we'll point and say "See, there is your problem, support us!!!
    The burden of proof is on the state. What specific laws were being broken? if it's misdemeanor trespassing or demonstrating without a permit (in the case of Atlanta, the permit was revoked), you think that warrants tear gas and rubber bullets?

    Throwing firecrackers and buckets could be seen as assault. So what is throwing a flash grenade at a wounded man?

    Your low opinion of the protesters does not justify state violence.

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    Re: Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    They have. The people were told to clear the streets and they refused. The police then cleared the streets. Justified. You want to protest? Great. You want to be civilly disobedient? Fine. But when the policeman says its time to change the game then you either change it or face consequences. That you and others dont get that is both a mystery and a comedy.
    The police must use appropriate force. All I ask is that they justify every rubber bullet fired.

    Remember, the protest was weeks old, not hours. What changed, the protesters actions or the city's?
    Last edited by GhostlyJoe; 10-27-11 at 07:13 PM.

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    Re: Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    The police must use appropriate force. All I ask is that justify every rubber bullet fired.

    Remember, the protest was weeks old, not hours. What changed, the protesters actions or the city's?
    If you had a complete video of the events and not just the snipped version edited for cause you might have an answer to that. You might also inquire why the police were directed to disperse the crowds from the streets and parks. All of that is irrelevant when you are the 'peaceful protester' in question. When a police officer says you must stop...three guesses what you MUST do...(Id just say one guess because you already know the answer, but I'll give you the first two so you can rage on about your legal rights).

    Refuse to comply with a police officer on a traffic stop even if you believe you are totally in the right and guess what happens.

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    Re: Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

    Threads like this give me reason to smile in my own firm belief that many on the right who scream the loudest about liberty and freedom are more than happy to use any excuse to put the clamps of authority and repression on those on the left who they hate and despise. And they bristle when we accuse the authoritarian right wing of having fascist tendencies.
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    Re: Occupy Oakland Attacked By Tear Gas, Rubber Bullets, and Flash Grenades

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    I think the point he was making is that this was no "dirty hippie", as FOX News, along with assholes of their ilk, likes to describe the protesters. He is a soldier, who served 2 tours in Iraq.
    That doesn't mean he isn't a dirty hippy. Clearly, he's shown a lack of discipline. When the cops tell you to un-ass an AO, you un-ass that AO, immediately.

    As a soldier, he should understand that there are rules and there are consequences for breaking those rules.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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