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Thread: Checking Herman Cain's math on 9-9-9

  1. #41
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    Re: Checking Herman Cain's math on 9-9-9

    Quote Originally Posted by vvx View Post
    I just don't see the need to subsidize reproduction. Yes, if we're really lucky, may be we can raise the population density of the country to the level of NYC. That'd be great. Let's do it! (I suspect the real reason we reward such behavior is because that demographic is a significant percentage of the vote.)
    Its a fine line. If people have too many kids, then overpopulation becomes a huge issue. However, if people don't replace themselves, then you end up with an aging population and as people retire, there are not enough workers / producers to replace them. Japans low birth rate is the main reason their economy has been stagnant for nearly 2 decades now. Its the main reason why western Europe has lagged the United States in economic growth for decades, and why they are in the fiscal shape they are in today.

    One of the problems with Cain's plan is that it substantially raises taxes on middle class parents, this could have the effect of discouraging having kids in the middle class, and would be a huge drag on economic growth in the United States in the coming decades. Of course, on the low end of the economic scale, they would do better to put off having kids until their financial situation improves.
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    Re: Checking Herman Cain's math on 9-9-9

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    It's essentially a value-added tax. It's a tax on the gross income less purchases from other businesses. So yes, it is drastically different from the corporate income tax as we know it. Effectively, the 9% business tax has the same effect an additional 9% retail sales tax.
    So essentially you're taxing a business twice with two different taxes?
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    Re: Checking Herman Cain's math on 9-9-9

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    From which it is DRASTICALLY different.



    I'm saying the 9% "business transaction tax" is, IN EFFECT (in other words, it is for all intents and purposes almost the same as a VAT tax.) Basically the entire plan is a 27% tax on wages/income or sales, depending on how you look at it. The business tax, the personal income tax, and the sales tax all essentially amount to a 27% tax on total income.

    TPC Tax Topics | Herman Cain
    You really need do a little research and learn what a VAT tax is. This tax is a SALES tax, NOT a VAT tax. Do you know the difference???? Obviously not.

    A VAT tax is paid by EACH purchaser of a product, all the way through the production process. A sales tax is paid by the purchaser of the finished product.

    Understand now ???

    And your statement about this being a 27% tax is so far in left field that there's no use even starting to refute it.

    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





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    Re: Checking Herman Cain's math on 9-9-9

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    That's ridiculous. His plan is ridiculous and that is why he cannot provide a reasonable answer as to how it would actually work and how it would not result in a tax increase.
    You could have made this post much shorter by simply stating that Cain is a conservative so his plan must be ridiculous.

    Look, I don't like the plan either, but your snide remark that he must have failed math class is absurd. He has been ten times more successful in his life than Obama ever dreamed of.

    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





  5. #45
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    Re: Checking Herman Cain's math on 9-9-9

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    You could have made this post much shorter by simply stating that Cain is a conservative so his plan must be ridiculous.

    Look, I don't like the plan either, but your snide remark that he must have failed math class is absurd. He has been ten times more successful in his life than Obama ever dreamed of.
    I did not say he failed math class. I said his plan was ridiculous, would kill business, and regressively increase taxes on the poor and middle class. That is the same critique that conservatives have made against his plan. Moreover, the guy ran a medium sized business with a few hundred million a year in revenues. That is small potatoes compared to the business careers of Romney and Huntsman. Romney founded Bain Capital which has somewhere around 66 billion in assets. In terms of business leaders on in the Republican Primaries, Cain is like comparing a recreational jogger to Olympic qualifiers.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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    Re: Checking Herman Cain's math on 9-9-9

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    I did not say he failed math class. I said his plan was ridiculous, would kill business, and regressively increase taxes on the poor and middle class. That is the same critique that conservatives have made against his plan. Moreover, the guy ran a medium sized business with a few hundred million a year in revenues. That is small potatoes compared to the business careers of Romney and Huntsman. Romney founded Bain Capital which has somewhere around 66 billion in assets. In terms of business leaders on in the Republican Primaries, Cain is like comparing a recreational jogger to Olympic qualifiers.
    My mistake, it was lpast that claimed he failed math class.

    I'm definitely not sold on Cain. My favorite is Romney, but the attempts to blatantly smear the man's career are disgusting. Godfather's pizza might not be that large, but he also served as the CEO of the National Restaurant Assoc. and served on the Board of Directors of the Federal Reserve Bank, Nabisco, and Whirlpool among others. His business experience matches well with anyone and makes Obama's past job experiences look foolish.

    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





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    Re: Checking Herman Cain's math on 9-9-9

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    Cain has a degree in mathematics and a Masters in computer science, so sounds like he did just fine in math class.




    What most critics of Cain's plan forget to take into account is the lower prices for goods and services that will result. Businesses will have lower corporate taxes and will pay almost 8% less for employee salaries. Presumably, the lower costs will be passed through to consumers.

    While I'm not convinced that Cain's plan is the way to go, Politifact is not being accurate, which is not unusual for them.
    Hell will freeze over before consumers benefit from corporations making more money.
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    Re: Checking Herman Cain's math on 9-9-9

    Quote Originally Posted by Mickey Shane View Post
    Hell will freeze over before consumers benefit from corporations making more money.
    I would reply, buy your post makes absolutely no sense.

    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





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    Re: Checking Herman Cain's math on 9-9-9

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    You really need do a little research and learn what a VAT tax is. This tax is a SALES tax, NOT a VAT tax. Do you know the difference???? Obviously not.

    A VAT tax is paid by EACH purchaser of a product, all the way through the production process. A sales tax is paid by the purchaser of the finished product.

    Understand now ???

    And your statement about this being a 27% tax is so far in left field that there's no use even starting to refute it.
    Err no. VAT is only paid by the end consumer. Companies do not in the end pay VAT on their buys since it gets refunded. That is why many people in companies often try to buy big price items (computers and such) via the company so to save the VAT.
    PeteEU

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    Re: Checking Herman Cain's math on 9-9-9

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Err no. VAT is only paid by the end consumer. Companies do not in the end pay VAT on their buys since it gets refunded. That is why many people in companies often try to buy big price items (computers and such) via the company so to save the VAT.
    Errr, no. VAT is paid by each company that buys a product in the manufacturing process.

    Value added tax (VAT) in theory avoids the cascade effect of sales tax by taxing only the value added at each stage of production. For this reason, throughout the world, VAT has been gaining favour over traditional sales taxes. In principle, VAT applies to all provisions of goods and services. VAT is assessed and collected on the value of goods or services that have been provided every time there is a transaction (sale/purchase). The seller charges VAT to the buyer, and the seller pays this VAT to the government.
    Value added tax - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





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