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Thread: Gm moves to China

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    Re: Gm moves to China

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari
    It's time to slap huge tariffs on China and give GM the ol' middle finger.
    Mmmm not yet - let it completely pay back TARP (to my knowledge it is not COMPLETELY paid back yet) and get it in black ink - then go protectionism on their asses.

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    Re: Gm moves to China

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    sorry, meant to say......the average worker makes about 30 bucks an hour, not $46. there are other costs of having employees besides salary and benefits. ss, for one. and i know also know personally what the salaries are, given that my husband retired from gm.
    We have a neighbor who worked at the GM plant here for 30+ years. He was a line supervisor and made $100k a year doing it before they pushed him into early retirement. I was confused as to how a supervisor could be making the same as the average line worker.
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    Re: Gm moves to China

    This is incredibly convoluted. There would be nothing wrong with a company with the technology combining with a company with the need to come together for the benefit of both. That is, if GM helped a Chinese company build cars for the Chinese market that in itself is not a bad thing.

    The problem is, the Chinese people can not afford to buy these cars. That being the case, as the article notes, the government buys them for them. It allows these companies to continue paying their employee's just a few bucks keeping costs low which GM will see as an oppertunity to then ship these cars over here at the expense of American employee's.

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    Re: Gm moves to China

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Being that China is the largest emerging market for them it only makes sense that they would build more production capacity in China. They have had a Shanghai Buick plant over there for years. When you are talking about items as large and as heavy as a vehicle, many times it's cheaper to produce it in the country you are selling them in rather than ship them around the world. That is why Japanese auto makers build many of their vehicles over here. GM vehicles are quite popular in China.
    as long as they follow all American OSHA and pollution controls, i have no problem with them manufacturing in China for China's emerging market.

    where i have a problem is outsourcing production for American market vehicles to China with no OSHA or pollution controls purely to gut labor costs. we simply can't afford to do business that way anymore.

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    Re: Gm moves to China

    Quote Originally Posted by 1Perry View Post
    This is incredibly convoluted. There would be nothing wrong with a company with the technology combining with a company with the need to come together for the benefit of both. That is, if GM helped a Chinese company build cars for the Chinese market that in itself is not a bad thing.

    The problem is, the Chinese people can not afford to buy these cars. That being the case, as the article notes, the government buys them for them. It allows these companies to continue paying their employee's just a few bucks keeping costs low which GM will see as an oppertunity to then ship these cars over here at the expense of American employee's.
    China sold more cars then the US did last year. China is the number 2 or 3 market for many european luxury brands. Buick sells more cars in China then the US.

    As for GM in China. GM already has a partnership in China with SAIC called simply enough SAIC-GM, as the majority of car makers are not allowed to set up plants in China without a local partner. SAIC also partners with VW, who also partners with FAW in China. If GM wants to sell cars in China it has to be able to build them in China as US built cars would be too expensive to sell in China. No jobs are being lost in the US because of this. As a side note GM China is a profitable enterprise, making money for GM, helping it to pay back the US government. So far China has not exported any cars to the US, and GM is very unlikely to start to do so. It does source or has sourced some engines from China. This joint venture is being created to allow GM to sell hybrid/electric cars in China, a market it would be stupid to left out off.
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    Re: Gm moves to China

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    It's time to slap huge tariffs on China and give GM the ol' middle finger.
    Our countrymen have become lazy and complacent. Not enough people are protesting for things to change, and the government is out to lunch with our money.

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    Re: Gm moves to China

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    as long as they follow all American OSHA and pollution controls, i have no problem with them manufacturing in China for China's emerging market.

    where i have a problem is outsourcing production for American market vehicles to China with no OSHA or pollution controls purely to gut labor costs. we simply can't afford to do business that way anymore.
    No GM built car has been exported from China to the US, and likely will not for at least 15 years. It does not have the capacity in China, nor will it gain all of the profits, should it do so. Labour and environmental standards in China are improving. Heck Chinese workers for Honda went on strike about 2 years ago for a few months and won a 25% wage increase
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    Re: Gm moves to China

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    No GM built car has been exported from China to the US, and likely will not for at least 15 years. It does not have the capacity in China, nor will it gain all of the profits, should it do so. Labour and environmental standards in China are improving. Heck Chinese workers for Honda went on strike about 2 years ago for a few months and won a 25% wage increase
    i am glad for them. however, i fear that manufacturing is a race to the bottom. as Chinese workers start to stand up for themselves, products will be made in the next zone of abject poverty with no OSHA or pollution controls.

    it's my opinion that we should not let those goods into the US market without significant tariffs.

    let's export American worker safety standards and humane manufacturing practices.

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    Re: Gm moves to China

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    i am glad for them. however, i fear that manufacturing is a race to the bottom. as Chinese workers start to stand up for themselves, products will be made in the next zone of abject poverty with no OSHA or pollution controls.

    it's my opinion that we should not let those goods into the US market without significant tariffs.

    let's export American worker safety standards and humane manufacturing practices.
    Now lets see this thinking through


    Coastal areas of China have seen higher levels of economic advancement and many earn good incomes and demand a cleaner environment combined with better working conditions. Some factories leave, yet the overall economic advancment in those regions remains high. The environmental demands are still left in place from the middle class Chinese who no longer have to worry about having money for food, but can afford to be concerned about the effects on their health from the environment. As the factories move to western china, the people in Western China see the same economic gains that those in the east have seen. As they become more demanding some factories will move to Vietnam, India and perhaps eventually parts of Africa.
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    Re: Gm moves to China

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    China sold more cars then the US did last year. China is the number 2 or 3 market for many european luxury brands. Buick sells more cars in China then the US.

    As for GM in China. GM already has a partnership in China with SAIC called simply enough SAIC-GM, as the majority of car makers are not allowed to set up plants in China without a local partner. SAIC also partners with VW, who also partners with FAW in China. If GM wants to sell cars in China it has to be able to build them in China as US built cars would be too expensive to sell in China. No jobs are being lost in the US because of this. As a side note GM China is a profitable enterprise, making money for GM, helping it to pay back the US government. So far China has not exported any cars to the US, and GM is very unlikely to start to do so. It does source or has sourced some engines from China. This joint venture is being created to allow GM to sell hybrid/electric cars in China, a market it would be stupid to left out off.
    I disagree with your assessment.

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