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Thread: Voters See These ‘Corporate Welfare’ Programs As A Good Place To Cut Government Spend

  1. #101
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    Re: Voters See These ‘Corporate Welfare’ Programs As A Good Place To Cut Government S

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    For one thing, there is nothing "redundant" about it. Studies show that even kids whose families receive food stamps do go hungry if not provided with a free lunch
    Then instead of another food program, that does nothing to treat the ****ty parent, what about a visit from a social worker?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    For another, why don't you use the "they don't need the welfare" argument when it comes to the oil depletion allowance, which is given to corps that are making record profits? It is hypocritical

    It is hypocritical to selectively use and drop "principles" when making arguments depending on who is being discussed. If you're going to say that the kids don't need free lunches because they get food stamps, then why is it OK to give welfare to profit making corps since their profits show that they don't need the money?
    It's already apparent that they don't need the depletion allowance.
    I'm not being selective with my principles, it's all time, place and situation.

    I never said it was ok to give a business more tax write offs, which isn't the same as welfare because welfare is giving someone money, while tax incentives allow them to keep more of their own money.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  2. #102
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    Re: Voters See These ‘Corporate Welfare’ Programs As A Good Place To Cut Government S

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Those aren't "big oil subsidies."
    They are tax credits that all businesses get to take.

    Why target one industry for the elimination?
    You don't have to, end all the subsidies. That includes the ones for big oil which was defeated. There's lots of specific subsidies out there, not only would you end all the big oil ones but farm subsidies and land subsidies and all of it. It may have to be voted on individually, but ending all subsidies of this manner is a step in the right direction.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
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  3. #103
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    Re: Voters See These ‘Corporate Welfare’ Programs As A Good Place To Cut Government S

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Then instead of another food program, that does nothing to treat the ****ty parent, what about a visit from a social worker?
    Once again you argue that "they don't need more help" to oppose welfare for individuals, but don't apply that to the oil corps. Hypocrisy in action

    It's already apparent that they don't need the depletion allowance.
    I'm not being selective with my principles, it's all time, place and situation.
    Again, hypocrisy in action. You're just offering excuses when you should be offering reasons. Once again, you abandon your principles, which seems to be a requirement for rightwing libertarians.

    I never said it was ok to give a business more tax write offs, which isn't the same as welfare because welfare is giving someone money, while tax incentives allow them to keep more of their own money.
    More hypocrisy. "It's not OK, but I won't oppose it."
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  4. #104
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    Re: Voters See These ‘Corporate Welfare’ Programs As A Good Place To Cut Government S

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    People aren't buying stock in pear and spinach futures, artificially fixing the price. But that happens with oil. It isn't as cut and dry as "competition".
    It's not so cut and dry, no. But there is relatively no competition in oil, the 3 refining companies which supply America are essentially an oligopoly. And oil futures kinda piss me off. If oil futures go up, so does the price of gas; pretty much immediately. But that wasn't from oil they bought at the high futures market price; it was oil they had already bought and refined. But there is most certainly lag if the opposite happens. It seems all so artificial. There are lots of places from corporate to Wallstreet that need to see an end to government handouts and have proper regulation installed.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  5. #105
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    Re: Voters See These ‘Corporate Welfare’ Programs As A Good Place To Cut Government S

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Once again you argue that "they don't need more help" to oppose welfare for individuals, but don't apply that to the oil corps. Hypocrisy in action



    Again, hypocrisy in action. You're just offering excuses when you should be offering reasons. Once again, you abandon your principles, which seems to be a requirement for rightwing libertarians.



    More hypocrisy. "It's not OK, but I won't oppose it."
    Again we're back to "sanga's improper understanding of hypocracy and his use as a means of character assassination."
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

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    Re: Voters See These ‘Corporate Welfare’ Programs As A Good Place To Cut Government S

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Again we're back to "sanga's improper understanding of hypocracy and his use as a means of character assassination."
    No, I have proven that hypocrisy does not require knowing dishonesty, though at this point, I don't see where you have room to even deny that.

    Again, look at the last definition, and you'll see no mention of dishonesty

    Pretense | Define Pretense at Dictionary.com
    pre·tense
       [pri-tens, pree-tens] Show IPA

    noun
    1. pretending or feigning; make-believe: My sleepiness was all pretense.

    2. a false show of something: a pretense of friendship.

    3. a piece of make-believe.

    4. the act of pretending or alleging falsely.

    5. a false allegation or justification: He excused himself from the lunch on a pretense of urgent business.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  7. #107
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    Re: Voters See These ‘Corporate Welfare’ Programs As A Good Place To Cut Government S

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    No, I have proven that hypocrisy does not require knowing dishonesty, though at this point, I don't see where you have room to even deny that.

    Again, look at the last definition, and you'll see no mention of dishonesty

    Pretense | Define Pretense at Dictionary.com
    Yes it does, when someone "pretends" they are intentionally putting on a false front.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiki
    Hypocrisy is the state of pretending to have beliefs, opinions, virtues, ideals, thoughts, feelings, qualities, or standards that one does not actually have.[1] Hypocrisy involves the deception of others and is thus a kind of lie[1].

    Hypocrisy is not simply failing to practice those virtues that one preaches. Samuel Johnson made this point when he wrote about the misuse of the charge of "hypocrisy" in Rambler No. 14:

    Nothing is more unjust, however common, than to charge with hypocrisy him that expresses zeal for those virtues which he neglects to practice; since he may be sincerely convinced of the advantages of conquering his passions, without having yet obtained the victory, as a man may be confident of the advantages of a voyage, or a journey, without having courage or industry to undertake it, and may honestly recommend to others, those attempts which he neglects himself.[2]

    Thus, an alcoholic's advocating temperance, for example, would not be considered an act of hypocrisy as long as the alcoholic made no pretense of constant sobriety.
    Hypocrisy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Further your understanding and interpretation of my stance is false because of the incongruousness of the situations you are comparing.
    A subsidy for people with low income ≠ tax reduction for a profitable business
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  8. #108
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    Re: Voters See These ‘Corporate Welfare’ Programs As A Good Place To Cut Government S

    OMB watch is progressive spin, particularly on climate data, taxing policy and environmental policy. They went and put out a race demographic about the so called super committee thats going to decide how to handle budget cuts. They dont follow the progressive meme, they create it

    Go reasearch what the writers pet causes are and you will see what I mean.

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    Re: Voters See These ‘Corporate Welfare’ Programs As A Good Place To Cut Government S

    Quote Originally Posted by OpportunityCost View Post
    OMB watch is progressive spin, particularly on climate data, taxing policy and environmental policy. They went and put out a race demographic about the so called super committee thats going to decide how to handle budget cuts. They dont follow the progressive meme, they create it

    Go reasearch what the writers pet causes are and you will see what I mean.
    Oddly, they had the low numbers.They say 3 times more. Others say ten times more. As I said, it depends on how you measure it. I merely went with the lower numbers to avoid silly fights over the numbers.

    BTW, pet causes or leaning a certain direction isn't what makes something unreliable. Being factually inaccurate is what does that. The American non-Thinker isn't useless because it is conservative, it's useless because it is silly and inaccurate.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Voters See These ‘Corporate Welfare’ Programs As A Good Place To Cut Government S

    Yeah but the source youre using is using numbers and statistics to support certain memes. Its not inaccurate but the conclusions its drawing and its presentation are shaded to present a certain picture. They present themselves as an unbiased source but they are unmistakeably progressive in outlook and conclusions.

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