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Thread: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    It's explained by the growth in GDP due to Clintons policies which created 22 million new jobs and 22 million new taxpayers. The reason we have a deficit now is due to bush*'s job destruction program, fueled by tax cuts and runaway spending.
    And yet there is a reasonable, alternative view:

    . . . it is more accurate to say that the economy in the 1990s continued growing strong despite the tax increases! In fact, the economy was strong enough before Congress voted on the tax bill that it was able to digest the tax increases which were signed August 10, 1993. Let's look at the numbers as to how things were following the downturn of two decades ago.

    The economy was out of recession in March of 1991. This is em, er...before Clinton announced in October of that year that he was running for president, and almost two and a half years before President Clinton signed his tax law.
    In the twelve months leading up to the tax signing (August 1992-July 1993), the economy gained 2,023,000 jobs, which is 168,000 jobs per month. To put things into perspective: in the four years during which Democrats recently controlled Congress, we did not have a twelve-month period where the economy gained 100,000 jobs on a monthly average, let alone 168,000 to meet an economy of fifteen years earlier.
    In the six months (February-July 1993) leading up to the tax signing, the monthly average job gain was already 208,000, which shows that the economy was growing stronger by the month, well before the bill was signed.
    The unemployment rate peaked July 1992 -- more than six months before Clinton stepped into the Oval Office, and more than twelve months before Congress voted on the tax bill. In fact, the rate lost almost a full percentage point in the twelve months leading up to the tax signing.
    The Dow Jones Industrial Average reached a low (of less than 2,400) in October 1990, and then things turned around, which is em...say...three years before your Clinton taxes "gave us" a good economy!
    From its recession low of minus 2,400, the Dow grew almost 50% to approximately 3,600 before we got to August 1993. This amounts to a 16% annual gain if any Dem had his/her money in an Index fund piggybacked to the Dow.
    The Clinton Tax Myth (Clinton raised taxes on the top earners and then gained 22 million jobs?)

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    And there are no communists here. Not Obama, not anyone. That kind of talk marks someone as a nutter, an unorignal nutter.
    Agreed. He is a Marxist. And a Democrat. Spread the wealth....

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Pretty much. Never underestimate the human ability to make anything souond like something else. I just wish those who did this were more original. These type of scare tatics are as old as the union.
    And Marxism (and communism) have always had their useful idiots to help move history along...

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    If Obama said it, it must be true because everyone knows that Obama never lies, right apdst?
    Sometimes his teleprompter does...

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Yes, when my familys' bill exceed our income, the first thing I do is work fewer hours for less pay. Isn't that what every family does?
    Your metaphor fails you.
    Lowering tax rates permanently increases economic activity. That in turn increases tax revenues.

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Agreed. He is a Marxist. And a Democrat. Spread the wealth....
    Can we agree you don't know WTF you are talking about???


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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    Can we agree you don't know WTF you are talking about???
    LOL. I am quite certain that anyone with your track record would have your opinion. But that changes nothing about Barack Hussein Obama, mentored by communists, pastored by Marxists (the Soviet Union funded Black Liberation Theology), and whose defining characteristic is a hatred of private enterprise and capitalism.
    He grew up on Saul Alinsky, Here is what one author wrote about Saul"

    Alinsky was an intensely clever fellow with no compunction about exploiting popular sentiment to achieve his ends. One of his favorite methodologies was to use America’s founders to back his own Marxism. As Breitbart writes, “Alinsky’s clever merging of fake founding philosophy with his own Marxism led him to internal contradictions that would have sunk a lesser ego. While championing ‘freedom,’ for example – he hated the idea of individual freedom the Founders loved – he [pushed for] ‘communal freedom,’ which is to say tyranny led by the government.”
    Obama was raised in the Alinsky tradition, and he speaks with Alinsky’s forked tongue. Thus, for example, Obama opened his speech by stating that Americans have historically “put our faith in free markets and free enterprise as the engine of America’s wealth and prosperity … we are rugged individualists, a self-reliant people with a healthy skepticism of too much government.”
    So far, so good. But Obama continues: “But there has always been another thread running throughout our history – a belief that we are all connected; and that there are some things we can only do together, as a nation.” This is un-American, and it is a lie. American unity doesn’t occur in opposition to free markets, but in defense of them.
    Barack Obama’s Arrogant Marxist Rhetoric | FrontPage Magazine

    I could go on for hours. If it quacks like a (Marxist) duck, and waddles like a (Marxist) duck, and swims like a (Marxist) duck, it is most likely a Marxist duck.

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Your metaphor fails you.
    Lowering tax rates permanently increases economic activity. That in turn increases tax revenues.
    Oh yeh! That's why there was not one net new job created during the Great GWSnotForBrains Depression and tenure. 8 years of tax cuts and no jobs. What kind of proof do you need that the tax cuts just made the rich a bit richer. It allowed them to move their factories and equipment to China, as far as I can tell. How 'bout them jobs there in Alabammy.?? Your quote on economic activity must be part of a more serious delusion, don't you think?

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Oh yeh! That's why there was not one net new job created during the Great GWSnotForBrains Depression and tenure. 8 years of tax cuts and no jobs. What kind of proof do you need that the tax cuts just made the rich a bit richer. It allowed them to move their factories and equipment to China, as far as I can tell. How 'bout them jobs there in Alabammy.?? Your quote on economic activity must be part of a more serious delusion, don't you think?
    Aw, great, another person who buys the media spin and leftwing rhetoric but ignores the Obama results. These are the results you support

    Obama economic results in 2011, .4% GDP and 1.3% GDP growth in 2011, 24+ million unemployed or under employed Americans in 2011, 4 trillion added to the debt in less than 3 years, and a downgrade of the U.S. credit rating. Rising Misery index 7.83 to 12.67. First President in U.S. History to have our credit downgraded on his watch!

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Oh yeh!
    Yeah!

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    That's why there was not one net new job created during the Great GWSnotForBrains Depression and tenure. 8 years of tax cuts and no jobs.
    Quandary:

    Mr. Bush boasted about 52 consecutive months of job growth during his presidency. What matters is the magnitude of growth, not ticks on a calendar. The economic expansion under Mr. Bush — which it is safe to assume is now over — produced job growth of 4.2 percent. That is the worst performance over a business cycle since the government started keeping track in 1945.
    Through Bush-Colored Glasses - New York Times
    I selected a source hostile to President Bush just for fun.

    What were the causes of the Recession? I believe the most important cause was the destruction done to our mortgage lending industries by Congressional Democrats like Frank and Dodd. Here are a few quotes:

    1990s

    With the mechanisms in place, the community organizing groups began developing directed strategies to exert more and more pressure on the lending industry in the cloak of complicity with CRA. Community organizer Barack Obama worked closely with ACORN activists. Employing the radical Alinsky intimidation tactics Obama had learned and was teaching -- "direct action" -- activists crowded bank lobbies, blocked drive-up teller lanes and demonstrated at the homes of bankers to browbeat risky lending in poor and minority communities. Those who resisted were accused of racism to the media and government officials.
    June 1995

    Republicans had won control of Congress and planned CRA reforms. The Clinton Administration, however, allied with Rep. Frank, Sen. Kennedy (D-Massachusetts) and Rep. Waters (D-California), did an end-around by directing HUD Secretary Andrew Cuomo to inject GSEs into the subprime mortgage market.

    As Kurtz notes,"ACORN had come to Congress not only to protect the CRA from GOP reforms but also to expand the reach of quota-based lending to Fannie, Freddie and beyond." What resulted was the broadening of the "acceptability of risky subprime loans throughout the financial system, thus precipitating our current crisis."
    Kurtz concludes, "Urged on by ACORN, congressional Democrats and the Clinton administration helped push tolerance for high-risk loans through every sector of the banking system -- far beyond the sort of banks originally subject to the CRA. So it was the efforts of ACORN and its Democratic allies that first spread the subprime virus from the CRA to Fannie and Freddie and thence to the entire financial system. Soon, Democratic politicians and regulators actually began to take pride in lowered credit standards as a sign of ‘fairness' -- and the contagion spread."

    Attorney General Janet Reno, with a number of bank lending discrimination settlements already, sternly announces, "We will tackle lending discrimination wherever it appears." With the new policy in full force, "No loan is exempt; no bank is immune." "For those who thumb their nose at us, I promise vigorous enforcement," reiterated Reno.

    1997

    HUD Secretary Cuomo said "GSE presence in the subprime market could be of significant benefit to lower-income families, minorities, and families living in underserved areas . . ."

    And on it went to collapse. Of course Democrats will want to blame Bush as often as possible.
    Last edited by Misterveritis; 08-13-11 at 09:45 PM.

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